The One Ring :: View topic - Mûmakil of Harad vs Rivendell (LONG)

Any piccies (just 1 or 2)?

The twin rolled a 1 on the resulting check and ultimately decided to burn all three might points to avoid the spell. This was crucial as it only left a single point of might on the side of the elves.

How did the Watchers of Karna perform against the enemy (of a similar points value)? Are they worth it?

Mumakil of Harad
Mumak w/ Haradrim Chieftan Commander x1
Ringwraith (1/7/0)
Watcher of Karna x4
Haradrim Warrior w/ Bow x8
Haradrim Warrior (Hand Weapon) x3
Haradrim Warrior w Spear x11
-------------------------------
29 Models. 3 Might

I would caution about getting the Mahud Chief in a tournament army. The extra M/W/F for the bargain price is very tempting, but remember he's standing out there without any protection.

I love your reports Brent, they are always so cool to read...now I only wish I could get into a game against you...gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster.

BilboOfTheWhiteTower wrote:

I love your reports Brent, they are always so cool to read...now I only wish I could get into a game against you...gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster.

Are you still planning on coming out to Chicago for the GT? We could likely face off there.

I had every intention of doing so, but because of my parents both being so ill it isn't looking like a possibility this year.

gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster.

That actually reminds me of a thought I had. One of the new options for upgrading your Mumuk is to give the passengers access to rocks to throw. They are actually pretty deadly (I'm stall amazed how GW makes hand-tossed stones more powerful than bows), but have a short range limit. At first I was discarding the option from my mind but reading this over again it has brought a possibility to light.

We often take on larger, more powerful foes by using spear support. A key tactic then is to draw off or eliminate the spear support to shift the odds in your favor. If you gave everyone in the Howdah the chance to pelt the attacking force with rocks then you increase the chance of doing just that. Obviously, this means even MORE points sunk into the already expensive Mumuk but if you're playing a larger game and can afford to do so it could prove a worthy addition.

Beowulf03809 wrote:

I'm right there with you. my upgraded version of this army does add that. In my mind, adding Gnarled Hide, Rappelling Lines, and Rocks are the three best upgrades.

I've got a 600pt army that looks like this:

Mumakil of Far Harad (Gnarled Hide, Rappeling Lines, Tusk Weapons, Rocks, and Sigils of Defense)
Haradrim Commander
Mahûd Warrior w/ Blowpipe x12

Ringwraith on Darksteed (1/8/0)

It lacks the ground force that I'm finding important but the Mahud in the Howdah get to shoot on 3+ with rocks

That's sweet.

Anyway, adding rocks to this 500pt force would cost me 4-5 warriors on foot. Not sure I'm willing to do that (yet).

Author:	BrentS [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:30 pm ]
Post subject:	Mûmakil of Harad vs Rivendell (LONG)
I got a chance to head down to the Chicago Battle Bunker again last night to give my next revision of a GamesDay army a workout. When I got there, Drunken Mick (Kevin) and Knitemare (Jay) were just finishing up a game of Take and Hold. As best as I could hear, the dwarves won the day on that game. Knitemare stepped up to challenge the Mûmakil of Harad. He brought an army of High Elves led by the twin sons of Elrond - Elrohir and Elladan. His Rivendell contingent had 35 Models, 11 of which were bows. Most everyone had shields and spears or shields and swords. A few elven blades were scattered for good measure. We rolled for scenarios and drew Storm the Camp. We rolled for terrain and ended up with 7 pieces total. In three of the four corners, broken down buildings were placed in 3 of the four corners. In the fourth corner, a small hill was placed. We had a decent sized ruin in the middle (built from the LOTR terrain box) and a large rock. We decided for the last piece of terrain to just spread out four individual trees. Jay won the roll for picking corners - he selected one of the abandoned buildings leaving me with the corner with the opposite building. He deployed with his elven bows and a single model with a HW up against the broken wall. I deployed with 10 warriors in the Howdah (8 bows, 2 hand weapon) and a Haradrim Chieftain on top. That left me with twelve Haradrim warriors, four Watchers of Karna, and a Nazgul on foot. The Mûmak only had one place to deploy based on the terrain layout. I deployed all the foot soldiers to his right side in a tight formation with the WoK and RW in the middle. The first turns resulting in the elven melee contingent moving forward around the left side (my left) of the ruins in the middle. The elven archers inched forward a bit and let off two rounds of volley fire. The archery dice really weren't on Jay's favor most of the night - with 22 dice in the first two turns. He managed to roll one six which did not result in a wound. The mûmak moved steadily forward squashing two trees in its path (we used the optional rules that trees could be trampled with the Mumak). My archers proved to have a bit more luck in the early rounds - managing to kill two elven warriors in direct firing range. My ground force moved toward the left side of the ruin to size up the inevitable elven assault. Somewhere around turn 3 or 4, the elves had moved close enough to be within charging range of my line of Haradrim. I actually didn't position my models correctly as I had hoped to be out of range. I won priority but sensing that we were venerable, Elladan (or was it Elrohir - Heck, I never called them by the correct names) called an uncontested heroic move and made the charge. Jay was able to tie up at least 8 of my spear armed haradrim with a daring charge towards my line. For the most part he had spear support for ever elf and I had a single Haradrim in combat. It was looking grim for the evil warriors of Harad. I had been out of position to call a reasonable counter HM and had withstand this assault.. On my counter move, I was able to swing one spear support and a Watcher of Karna around the left side of his flank into on fight. The models on the right side of the line, moved straight back into my camp and chose not to engage or support their comrades. The Nazgul cast transfixed one twin only to have it avoided with the use of will augmented by a point of might. The Mumak rotated back towards the battleline. I had a corner of the ruins to contend with but I still had enough of an angle that I could trample into combat. The mighty beast moved forward and the first victim of the trample was a Haradrim warrior! Such is the value of life in the service of evil. The trample continued taking out 5 elven warriors and three more haradrim warriors. Unbelievably, the Mumak was stopped dead in his tracks by a resilient elven warrior - three strength 9 hits resulted in a 1, 1, and 2!! Elrohir (or was it Elladan?) would have been the next trample victim followed by his twin brother. The ensuing combats worked out largely as you'd expect, the elves crushed the single haradrim warriors and I won the fight with the WoK and two spears. All in all I took 8 casualties and he took 6 and really avoided disaster from the trample. The elves won the next priority roll, with both sides predictably calling a Heroic Move and counter Heroic Move. The roll off went to side of evil and the Mumak lurched forward to trample the first twin. He stopped dead in his tracks again. 1, 2, 4 on the rolls to wound. He caused one wound which was ultimately saved by fate. I was beginning to think the mighty Mumak would be brought down. The elven twins charged into the Mumak and brought their spear supporting brothers with them. In my counter moves, I picked off as many of the spear supporters as I could with available Haradrim and Watchers. The Nazgul spent two will casting Transfix on one of the twins. I only managed a roll of 4! Still enough for the spell to go off but I didn't have a lot of confidence. The twin rolled a 1 on the resulting check and ultimately decided to burn all three might points to avoid the spell. This was crucial as it only left a single point of might on the side of the elves. As expected, the elves won the fight and put on two wounds to the Mûmak. The courage check for the potential stampede were passed on both occasions. I won the next priority, and just like the last turn, both sides contest with HM Again, the roll-off favored the side of evil. I was able to trample an elven warrior before hitting the twins. As best as I can recall (the details are still a bit fuzzy) the twins survived this trample. The elves counter charged the Mûmak and managed another wound. The courage check was passed. Both of the twins and the Haradrim commander were out of might and the Mûmak's ability to move now rested solely in the hands of priority. The Nazgul continued to try and transfix the twins but couldn't make the spell hit and was eventually reduced to one will. The elves were broken and the Haradrim where two models away from breaking. I hadn't commented much on the archery but Jay had been managing to pick apart models on the Howdah such that only 5 remained - two archers, two with swords, and the commander. He also started to move a single elf toward my basecamp. I moved a Watcher of Karna, a Haradrim warrior, and the Nazgul to intercept and protect my camp. I was shortly broken. The Nazgul kept a few warriors in the game by passing his courage tests (barely!) on multiple occasions. The Mûmak finally got his full trample going killing both twins in the same turn. The first killed by missing two fate rolls and the second died when all three trample attacks hit and there wasn't enough fate to save him. Surprisingly, the elven archers failed about half their courage tests over the next couple turns as the Mumak turn course and made a line for the last of the elven warriors. The archers on the howdah managed a single poison arrow re-roll kill on the Elf guarding the camp and the Mûmak eventually caught up with the last of the elven archers. They tried to swarm the Mumak (only three left) and ultimately lost the fight. Those that survived the combat were trampled in the ensuing turn. The elves were eliminated resulting in a Major Victory for the forces of evil. In the end, the Mûmak had suffered 7 wounds and passed all seven courage tests. The Haradrim Commander had never been hit (though he wasn't actually targeted in direct range that much) and never had to use his point of will. For the first time since I've played with him, the Mûmak's trample showed what its all about. While I was shocked to be stopped dead in my tracks by an lone elf and almost as shocked to not bring down the first twin. In the end, the trample still did all the damage it could. I learned a lot from this game. As everyone online has been telling me, I needed some ground troops to support the Mûmak. Of course they were right. The ground troops allowed me to pick off some fights against the Mûmak and it also gave me a line of combats that I could just trample through. I added the Nazgul to the force to try and use the Harbinger of Evil to make it more difficult to charge the Mumak. Well, those pesky elves and their courage 5 didn't make that all that effective. The first two transfix spells went off well but were avoided. However, after that, I couldn't hit a spell to save my life. However, the Nazgul's courage was great for saving my Haradrim on foot. All in all, I'm quite pleased in the way the army played out. The game was very close most of the way and had the roll-offs gone Jay's way, the results could have been different. He didn't have a lot of luck rolling to wound the Mûmak and his archery really failed him. It was a major victory for me but it could have just as easily been a major defeat with slightly better dice for Jay.

Author:	Dorthonion [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:
Hmm. And all they needed was one mouse.... Any piccies (just 1 or 2)?

Author:	BrentS [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:
Dorthonion wrote: Any piccies (just 1 or 2)? Here you go: The battle got too intense and I totally forgot to take more pictures.

Author:	Beowulf03809 [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:
That's an awesome pic and a really good review of the battle. Very interresting to read as we don't see much Mumuk action locally with our group (yet!). I had thought of a Mumuk-based army for GD Baltimore but wouldn't be anywhere close to complete at the level of appearance I wanted and so I abandoned the idea early. It's nice to see someone else giving it a go. I bet you were sweating when your dice came up so low against that Elf Warrior, but I'm impressed how well Courage tests treated you. So many Wounds and not a single Stamped is awesome! It would have been a different game if you failed some of those. You also had a lot of luck that the Elves didn't target your Mumuk's commander as a priority. The use of the Nazgul is interresting and a little Magic can be a great thing, but as you found the Nazgul's spells are best used to try to weaken Heroes, but those often seem to resist at the most pesky times. At the cost of the Mumuk I would suggest you try a couple games with other options for a Hero for your foot troops. A Haradrim King is a decent bargain and has a Courage of 5. A Hashirim is a deadly combat model, and even Suladan on foot is a reasonably-priced named Hero. I don't know how much the Nazgul cost you based on how you set his stats but I'm pretty sure you could swap in a Haradrim King and have a good number of points left over. As many scenarios have objectives based on the number of models that do something I was thinking that getting a cheaper Hero to fill the role of the Nazgul could give you the points to get the Ropes upgrade to the Mumuk. If your objective is Domination, Reconoiter or Storm the Camp, for example, you can use the Mumuk to get all the passengers close, have them slide down the ropes to the objectives, and then use the Mumuk to disrupt / destroy your enemy force. Also, if you have several enemy models charging the Mumuk then you could have troops slide down to engage them. It may offer a few more tactical options for you than relying on your (relatively) weak foot line alone.

Author:	The Ironfoot [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:
nice pic, I love how your watchers look with the different colours. I should really consider the rope idea, It's brilliant. But the idea of a hashirim is also great! how many points did you play?

The One Ring http://ww.one-ring.co.uk/

Mûmakil of Harad vs Rivendell (LONG) http://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=12885	Page 1 of 2

Author:	BrentS [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:57 pm ]
Post subject:
Thanks guys. This was a 500pt game - sorry I didn't specifiy that! For this army, my points are very, very tight. I'm using a 1/7/0 Nazgul which is slightly above the cost a Haradrim King. I've definitely thought about trying a more combat hero. I could in theory sacrifice a WoK, a Haradrim Bow, and the RW and get a Chieftan and Ropes I think. The real benefit of the Nazgul, and primarily why I included him are the Harbinger of Evil. That courage modifier against any army other than elves (!) makes it very hard for him to get charged. I'd also like to use him to Transfix that pesky hero trying to kill my Mumak. Really in some ways, playing against Elves was worst case for me as I couldn't even tie on fights (high FV) and they had great courage. Also concerning the ropes... I've got a 500pt version that has Mahud on the Howdah w/ Ropes and they are great for disrupting combat on the ground. My problem with that army is I run out of points for ground based infantry support.

Author:	lorderkenbrand [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 8:13 pm ]
Post subject:
Great to read a detailed battle report ... so long since I last read one as good as this. Congrats on your victory! Im surprised that a mumak and a Nazgul in the same 500pt force came through. I thought the force was a little low in numbers and as Beowulf said maybe dropping the RW would be a postive move and replacing with another commander and more warriors, but your tactics seemed sound throughout, excellent stuff! Quote: The twin rolled a 1 on the resulting check and ultimately decided to burn all three might points to avoid the spell. This was crucial as it only left a single point of might on the side of the elves. But this was definitely the worst decision ever, those precious might points could have given the elves the initiative needed in pinning the mumak, ah well How did the Watchers of Karna perform against the enemy (of a similar points value)? Are they worth it?

Author:	BrentS [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 8:27 pm ]
Post subject:
lorderkenbrand wrote: How did the Watchers of Karna perform against the enemy (of a similar points value)? Are they worth it? Two attacks supported by a spear is great against anything other than an Elf! Even when I tied, I lost... and if I lost, I died. However, I think the WoK provide just enough "umph" to the army. By the way, here's my complete list: Brent wrote: Mumakil of Harad Mumak w/ Haradrim Chieftan Commander x1 Ringwraith (1/7/0) Watcher of Karna x4 Haradrim Warrior w/ Bow x8 Haradrim Warrior (Hand Weapon) x3 Haradrim Warrior w Spear x11 ------------------------------- 29 Models. 3 Might

Author:	Túron [ Wed Jul 02, 2008 8:35 pm ]
Post subject:
gr8 report! i love to see that my beloved miniature win against such powerful enemy!

Author:	Beowulf03809 [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:22 pm ]
Post subject:
The Nazgul's -1 Courage is great for many reasons. Not only protecting himself but possibly models that want to charge the Mumuk (based on where they start their charge) and also to help split a force apart once it is Broken (not too hard to do when you're using a Mumuk). But having only 7 points of Will does make him pretty vulnerable too and you can't use Transfix very much without risk of loosing the Nazgul thru combat attrition (-1 Will each fight). You did it well against one of the toughest armies you could have faced though so don't give up on him until you try a couple more games both with and without him. I would caution about getting the Mahud Chief in a tournament army. The extra M/W/F for the bargain price is very tempting, but remember he's standing out there without any protection. He has few things to block line-of-sight and he's also a lot closer to the ground and therefore more likely to come into bow range. Any force with decent bow fire could take him out in two or three turns when you're within range. If you're facing Legolas, Haldir or Thranduil then your odds are even lower. The Chieftain not only has the protection of his position but the extra height may also give him one extra turn of "protection" outside of fire range for all but Elf bows and long bows.

Author:	BilboOfTheWhiteTower [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:31 pm ]
Post subject:
I love your reports Brent, they are always so cool to read...now I only wish I could get into a game against you...gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster.

Author:	Joansean [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:38 pm ]
Post subject:
you have a knack for writing battle reports. I always enjoy to read them. don't forget to take some more pics next time though!

Author:	BrentS [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 3:29 pm ]
Post subject:
Beowulf03809 wrote: I would caution about getting the Mahud Chief in a tournament army. The extra M/W/F for the bargain price is very tempting, but remember he's standing out there without any protection. I've given up on using a Mahûd Beastmaster to drive the Mûmak. You are right in that its just not worth the risk of losing the Howdah's protection! In my Mahûd version of the army, I have a converted Mahûd figure proxying as a Haradrim Chieftan. However, he still follows the rules for the Haradrim. BilboOfTheWhiteTower wrote: I love your reports Brent, they are always so cool to read...now I only wish I could get into a game against you...gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster. Are you still planning on coming out to Chicago for the GT? We could likely face off there.

Author:	BrentS [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 4:02 pm ]
Post subject:
BilboOfTheWhiteTower wrote: I had every intention of doing so, but because of my parents both being so ill it isn't looking like a possibility this year. That's what I was afraid of Hopefully things work out and if not, then next year!

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Author:	Dorthonion [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 5:40 pm ]
Post subject:
BotWT wrote: Quote: gets some hobbit sticks and stones against that big monster. A mouse, I tell you! Okay, maybe something bigger to frighten a mumak (a big rat maybe). One squeak and they're off...

Author:	Beowulf03809 [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 6:14 pm ]
Post subject:
That actually reminds me of a thought I had. One of the new options for upgrading your Mumuk is to give the passengers access to rocks to throw. They are actually pretty deadly (I'm stall amazed how GW makes hand-tossed stones more powerful than bows), but have a short range limit. At first I was discarding the option from my mind but reading this over again it has brought a possibility to light. We often take on larger, more powerful foes by using spear support. A key tactic then is to draw off or eliminate the spear support to shift the odds in your favor. If you gave everyone in the Howdah the chance to pelt the attacking force with rocks then you increase the chance of doing just that. Obviously, this means even MORE points sunk into the already expensive Mumuk but if you're playing a larger game and can afford to do so it could prove a worthy addition.

Author:	BrentS [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:36 pm ]
Post subject:
Beowulf03809 wrote: That actually reminds me of a thought I had. One of the new options for upgrading your Mumuk is to give the passengers access to rocks to throw. They are actually pretty deadly (I'm stall amazed how GW makes hand-tossed stones more powerful than bows), but have a short range limit. At first I was discarding the option from my mind but reading this over again it has brought a possibility to light. We often take on larger, more powerful foes by using spear support. A key tactic then is to draw off or eliminate the spear support to shift the odds in your favor. If you gave everyone in the Howdah the chance to pelt the attacking force with rocks then you increase the chance of doing just that. Obviously, this means even MORE points sunk into the already expensive Mumuk but if you're playing a larger game and can afford to do so it could prove a worthy addition. I'm right there with you. my upgraded version of this army does add that. In my mind, adding Gnarled Hide, Rappelling Lines, and Rocks are the three best upgrades. I've got a 600pt army that looks like this: Mumakil of Far Harad (Gnarled Hide, Rappeling Lines, Tusk Weapons, Rocks, and Sigils of Defense) Haradrim Commander Mahûd Warrior w/ Blowpipe x12 Ringwraith on Darksteed (1/8/0) It lacks the ground force that I'm finding important but the Mahud in the Howdah get to shoot on 3+ with rocks That's sweet. Anyway, adding rocks to this 500pt force would cost me 4-5 warriors on foot. Not sure I'm willing to do that (yet).

Author:	lorderkenbrand [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:56 pm ]
Post subject:
Ouch! That 600 point list is a bummer for any good general I can only think of standing back and firing at the beast until its comander falls, then it becomes difficult to control doesn't it? I think a cavalry contingent could be a decent alternative to a ringwraith and some of those upgrades, that extra movement can ensure enemy units are tied up and leave you time to cause destruction with a stampede. But I still like that 600 point list.

Author:	Túron [ Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:03 pm ]
Post subject:
BrentS wrote: Beowulf03809 wrote: That actually reminds me of a thought I had. One of the new options for upgrading your Mumuk is to give the passengers access to rocks to throw. They are actually pretty deadly (I'm stall amazed how GW makes hand-tossed stones more powerful than bows), but have a short range limit. At first I was discarding the option from my mind but reading this over again it has brought a possibility to light. We often take on larger, more powerful foes by using spear support. A key tactic then is to draw off or eliminate the spear support to shift the odds in your favor. If you gave everyone in the Howdah the chance to pelt the attacking force with rocks then you increase the chance of doing just that. Obviously, this means even MORE points sunk into the already expensive Mumuk but if you're playing a larger game and can afford to do so it could prove a worthy addition. I'm right there with you. my upgraded version of this army does add that. In my mind, adding Gnarled Hide, Rappelling Lines, and Rocks are the three best upgrades. I've got a 600pt army that looks like this: Mumakil of Far Harad (Gnarled Hide, Rappeling Lines, Tusk Weapons, Rocks, and Sigils of Defense) Haradrim Commander Mahûd Warrior w/ Blowpipe x12 Ringwraith on Darksteed (1/8/0) It lacks the ground force that I'm finding important but the Mahud in the Howdah get to shoot on 3+ with rocks That's sweet. Anyway, adding rocks to this 500pt force would cost me 4-5 warriors on foot. Not sure I'm willing to do that (yet). i think that your force have too many points! Mumakil of Far Harad (Gnarled Hide, Rappeling Lines, Tusk Weapons, Rocks, and Sigils of Defense)...380 pts. Haradrim Commander...46 pts. Mahûd Warrior w/ Blowpipe x12....144 pts. Ringwraith on Darksteed (1/8/0)...65 pts. that is 635 pts. i think this is illegal in 600 pts. game!