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Dale and Laketown
http://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=26890		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Kasrkin [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Dale and Laketown
Hi folks, I'm after a bit of advice from someone who knows Middle-Earth well!

So I really like the Dale soldiers and I've seen some behind the scenes photos that feature Laketown soldiers (GW will surely make minis of these guys). I think the style of the two is great- I really like the thought of painting an army of these troops. But what is the relationship between these two locations?

My understanding is that after the Battle of five Armies, Dale is rebuilt and becomes the capital of the Kingdom of Dale, ruled by Bard and his descendants. Is Laketown then just a town within this kingdom?
Author:  Bofur The Dwarf [ Sat Nov 30, 2013 10:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
Hmm, I was a little confused at first, but then I think I got it. I'll give you my thoughts anyway.

Dale was a city outside Erebor. When Smaug attacked Erebor, Dale was also destroyed. So Dale is in ruin, hasn't been rebuilt because Smaug still inhabits Erebor.

Laketown is similar to Dale, but is poorer. It's further from Ererbor which means it's at less risk from Smaug. The Master of Laketown is mayor while Bard is just a captain.

I'm not entirely sure of these parts, I may be wrong but I'm sure someone will correct me. After the Battle of Five Armies, Dale is rebuilt and ruled by Bard and his descendants. During the Battle for Middle-Earth (Or War of the Ring), Dale is attacked by the Eastern Kingdoms. Drain and the soldiers of Erebor defend Dale. These were not shown in the films due to budget, but it happened in the book. This was to prevent any help from those men or the dwarves when Sauron assaulted Middle-Earth.

That's pretty much all the history I know myself. If you want to learn some more, you could go on Middle-Earth Wikia. They have loads there on anything you could possibly need! It's even an app :-D
Author:  Antonio_13 [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 2:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
I believe Laketown (also known as Esgaroth) was built by the survivors of Dale after Smaug's attack. It was built on the water so as to protect it from his flames.
After the Battle of Five Armies Bard and his descendants rebuild Dale, and maintain an alliance with Erebor as before. I'm not sure what the fate of Laketown is after Smaug attacks it however.
So yes, they are essentially the same civilisation, just brought low while in the dominion of the dragon, and rising again after his destruction.
I haven't looked too closely, but the guards of Laketown look almost identical to the warriors of Dale, except maybe colours. They have very similar hats anyway. This could be because of their heritage.
Author:  Dorthonion [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
The Encyclopedia of Arda is a decent quick reference for anyone who does not have a Tolkien reference library: I have links to references for both Dale and Esgaroth
http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/d/dale.html
http://www.glyphweb.com/arda/l/laketown.html
Wikipedia also has information:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lonely_Mountain
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esgaroth
It is very easy to get basic information out there and it often points out written references in Tolkien's works.
Author:  Blue Dragon [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 8:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
Antonio_13 wrote:
I haven't looked too closely, but the guards of Laketown look almost identical to the warriors of Dale, except maybe colours. They have very similar hats anyway. This could be because of their heritage.


From what I've seen of the Laketown Warriors in the films, they have blue uniforms, with armour that reminded me of Rohan Royal Guards without the mail, and helmets similar to the Warriors of Dale. Their iconography is of a fish, and is incorporated on their shields and the pommels of their swords.
Author:  Kasrkin [ Sun Dec 01, 2013 2:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
Thanks folks, that's all really useful information! I'm trying to piece together guidelines for an army from this area of Middle-Earth and I've found it a bit confusing till now (thanks Antonio, so Esgaroth is Laketown, I thought they were different places lol). Armies of Men are my favourites so these with their unique appearance are very interesting to me.

The uniforms of Laketown and Dale look very similar, the former is obviously derived from the latter, and I wonder if the two would ever appear side-by-side in battle. I suppose it's likely after Dale is re-established.
Author:  belgiumfire [ Mon Dec 30, 2013 12:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
Esgaroth is the name of Laketown after it was rebuild in stone when the dragon destroyed the wooden one.
Dale became the capital of several towns and villages as it expanded as far as the sea of rhun under the rule of the next three kings. My guess (just lack hard proof) is that Esgaroth (laketown) also came under the rule of Dale, but I guess that every town/village still has a great autonomy. (Dale never aimed to conquer them, but I guess more a kingdom that protect each other and will benefit all.)

I'm also planning to make this kind of army, I'm going to use the Laketown models as the law enforcers of Dale (lack of courage) and just paint them to match my slowly growing Dale force.

Sorry for all the guesses, have been reading alot of wiki's about this so after some time you'll never know which one is true.
Author:  Oldman Willow [ Mon Dec 30, 2013 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dale and Laketown
Quote:
Sorry for all the guesses, have been reading alot of wiki's about this so after some time you'll never know which one is true.

There are 12 volumes of the History Of Middle Earth. The story evolved over many years. Start with Wiki then verify the source. Foot notes are your friends.
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