500 point Mirkwood

WhoelsebutHaldir · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 8:06 am

Hey guys, so I'm going to be going to a small hobbit event in a few weeks. We are going to play 2 games, the first is Lords of battle against an opponent and the second game is going to be some big multiplayer game with everyone slugging it out. Anyway, I wrote up this Mirkwood list and wanted some feedback:

Legolas w/horse
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/shield
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/glaive
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/bow

Thranduil w/bow,armour
-1 Mirkwood Warriors w/shield
-1 Mirkwood Warrior w/glaive
-2 Mirkwood Warriors w/bow
-2 Mirkwood Rangers
-2 Mirkwood Knights
-4 Palace Guard w/shield
---------------
500

6 might, 26 elves, 14 to break, 8 bows+Thranduil+Legolas

My thinking was to have old Thranduil for his magic and to be my leader while Legolas snipes enemies and when the time is right, jumps into combat and whallops them!! Hence the old Thranduil profile and new Legolas.

I have some of every type of soldier in the list so changing things is no problemo.

Argish · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:22 am

WhoelsebutHaldir wrote:

Hey guys, so I'm going to be going to a small hobbit event in a few weeks. We are going to play 2 games, the first is Lords of battle against an opponent and the second game is going to be some big multiplayer game with everyone slugging it out. Anyway, I wrote up this Mirkwood list and wanted some feedback:

Legolas w/horse
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/shield
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/glaive
-4 Mirkwood Warriors w/bow

Thranduil w/bow,armour
-1 Mirkwood Warriors w/shield
-1 Mirkwood Warrior w/glaive
-2 Mirkwood Warriors w/bow
-2 Mirkwood Rangers
-2 Mirkwood Knights
-4 Palace Guard w/shield
---------------
500

6 might, 26 elves, 14 to break, 8 bows+Thranduil+Legolas

My thinking was to have old Thranduil for his magic and to be my leader while Legolas snipes enemies and when the time is right, jumps into combat and whallops them!! Hence the old Thranduil profile and new Legolas.

I have some of every type of soldier in the list so changing things is no problemo.

Replace the knights with mirkwood warriors or at least swap them to Legolas warband. You have only 2 and within a warband without a mounted hero, so quite useless cavalry without heroic charges.

I would also remove the rangers for mirkwood warriors or maybe palace guard to gain more C6. Use the extra poins for additional equipment.

Valadorn · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 2:49 pm

Use this force as a skirmish one, especially for Lords of battle. Shoot and go is extremely powerful especially if the opponent is slow or weak and noumerous.

WhoelsebutHaldir · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:40 pm

Argish, you have some good points but I put the knights in with Thranduil because they get a banner re-roll while close to him. They can also run over to Legolas's warband if I need them there. The only reason Legolas has a horse is because of some extra points I had to use up, not for him to lead the cavalry.

My idea with the knights was that they could sit behind Thranduils guys and once combat is joined go around and hit the side of the enemy formation. Or I could keep them alive for the late game and seize an objective with them.

polywags · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:01 pm

I think thats a good use for the knights. If anything I'd put them all with Thranduil since you're paying for their reroll rule you might as well try to get the most of it. I just got my packs mostly painted up and I am gonna give them few practices games. I am really interested in this list but I am a little lost as where to go with it. I've played the old wood elf list a lot but Thranduil's halls seems quite different. The only thing I would say is maybe consider replacing the one mirkwood ranger with a regular mirkwood elf with bow. I realize you probably only took him since you had the points to upgrade him from the regular elf but I feel like the rangers aren't that worth it unless you're taking them to exceed the bow limit. Otherwise you're really only getting the knife fighter rule, which can be good but it might be worth armoring up to palace guard instead.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

well 2 mirk knights wont be a very effective shocking troop being so few, they lack on punching but they do get banner effect nearby thran so they can be expected to win more combats than regular elves, specially on the charge.

THe idea of your knights on 3rdish rank to support your battle line and outflank your foe seems a good one, they got speed for it and they are a threat and to some point they can protect your line from unexpected line breach or flanking foes or rear attacks.

Their only problem for the last 2 points mentioned above its the cost, they need to make it worth those royal guard price guys, so I would say wont be the easiest knights to play with specially with low defence, but still can be done.

I would remove as many palace guard as you could, keep the minimum for an effective battle line formation if you still wanna take em. 2 of em cost as much as 4 naked elves, 4 naked with gear on cost a bit more than palace guard but stil there 4 on the field.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

which legolas are you using anyway?
if its the normal legolas greenleaf, the horse wont be best option, get cloak hide behind line and snipe stuff easily as you can do it.
If its the prince of mirkwood then yes get horse.

warrior of the north · **Posted:** Sun Jan 04, 2015 11:28 pm

I would swap the cavalry with leggy's warband or remove them because you have got the old Thranduil profile and you will need the new one for the Banner effect.
Because the rule book says this: "whilst mounted, Mirkwood Cavalry models count as being in range of a banner if they are within 6" of Thranduil, KING OF THE WOODLAND REALM. Besides the knights will be a primary target for your opponent to take out with archery and once the horse dies you will lose the banner effect aswell. I'm sorry to kinda ruin your tactic but since you're going to a tournement, I had to warn you for this.

And good luck with the tournament and especially enjoy it!

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

yes I remembered that rule of the knights as I went to check it, was good to be true about any Thran would give em banner effect.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

Anyway I can try to give you an alternative for that

Mirkwood 500pts

Warband 1

Thranduil with armour and elf bow
3 Palace guards with shield
5 mirkwood elves with Glaive
4 mirkwood rangers

Legolas prince of the woodland realm on horse
4 mirkwood elves with shield
4 mirkwood elves with glaive and in which 2x with elven bow
4 mirkwood elves with elven bow

total: 500pts

might: 6
models 26
bows: 10 + 2 heroes

OR:

Warband 1
Thranduil with armour and elf bow
4 mirkwood rangers

Warband 2
Legolas greenleaf with cloak and armour
5 mirkwood rangers

warband 3
Tauriel, the exiled
1 Great Eagle

total: 496pts
might: 9
models: 13
bows: 11
monsters: 1

OR

Warband 1
Thranduil with armour and elf bow
10 mirkwood rangers

Warband 2

Tauriel, the exiled
2 great eagles

495pts
might: 6
models: 14
bows: 11

Asamu · **Posted:** Mon Jan 05, 2015 3:17 am

First list looks pretty solid, but you can get 2 more bows.
Also, the Palace guard should have spears if you can afford them. being able to support with the F6 is great vs other F5 armies.

Brings it to
Legolas (Orcrist) on horse
12 mirkwood elves
3x shield/blade, 3x glaive, 6x bow.

Thranduil w/armour and bow
5 mirkwood elves: 3xshield, 2x bow
3 palace guard w/spear+shield
2x cav or 2 more palace guard w/ spear+shield
2x rangers (2 and every 3rd after 2 (so at 5/8/etc) maximizes bow count.)

bows: 10+leg/thran
Break point: 14 dead

The cav are fragile, but having them for the knock-down double strikes will be quite handy if they survive to combat. The odds that they die to shooting are the same as Palace guard until the horse dies.
Using them to support the infantry or cancel out enemy cavalry is going to be the ideal use. They aren't going to be particularly effective on their own, but it's always good to have a few cav models in the force.

@Galanur:
First list has too many bows. Rangers are ignored completely for bow limit, so 1/3 of the remaining models. With 4 rangers and 24 models, you have a max of 11 bows before heroes.

Lists 2 and 3 don't have enough bodies, and rangers are fragile in combat. The knife fighter rule won't come into effect if they don't bother hitting with multiple models, and with rangers being only d3, they go down fast once combat hits. IMO, it's better to mix the rangers in with basic mirkwood elves to make the most of the cloaks and keep reasonable combat potential.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

Asamu wrote:

First list looks pretty solid, but you can get 2 more bows.
Also, the Palace guard should have spears if you can afford them. being able to support with the F6 is great vs other F5 armies.

Brings it to
Legolas (Orcrist) on horse
12 mirkwood elves
3x shield/blade, 3x glaive, 6x bow.

Thranduil w/armour and bow
5 mirkwood elves: 3xshield, 2x bow
3 palace guard w/spear+shield
2x cav or 2 more palace guard w/ spear+shield
2x rangers (2 and every 3rd after 2 (so at 5/8/etc) maximizes bow count.)

[color=#BF0000]( you got 1 more bow than valid = 22 warriors 1/3 its 7,3% = 7, you got 8 non mirk rangers)[/color]

bows: 10+leg/thran
Break point: 14 dead

The cav are fragile, but having them for the knock-down double strikes will be quite handy if they survive to combat. The odds that they die to shooting are the same as Palace guard until the horse dies.
Using them to support the infantry or cancel out enemy cavalry is going to be the ideal use. They aren't going to be particularly effective on their own, but it's always good to have a few cav models in the force.

@Galanur:
First list has too many bows. Rangers are ignored completely for bow limit, so 1/3 of the remaining models. With 4 rangers and 24 models, you have a max of 11 bows before heroes. (check the list again as I mentioned 2 of the mirk armoured guys got bow its 6,6% bow limit of all = 6)

Lists 2 and 3 don't have enough bodies, and rangers are fragile in combat. The knife fighter rule won't come into effect if they don't bother hitting with multiple models, and with rangers being only d3, they go down fast once combat hits. IMO, it's better to mix the rangers in with basic mirkwood elves to make the most of the cloaks and keep reasonable combat potential.

Asamu · **Posted:** Mon Jan 05, 2015 6:07 am

Galanur wrote:

( you got 1 more bow than valid = 22 warriors 1/3 its 7,3% = 7, you got 8 non mirk rangers)

"Your army can have one third (rounding up) of its models armed with any type of bow or crossbow."
With 22 models, you can have 8 bows.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

Asamu wrote:

Galanur wrote:

( you got 1 more bow than valid = 22 warriors 1/3 its 7,3% = 7, you got 8 non mirk rangers)

"Your army can have one third (rounding up) of its models armed with any type of bow or crossbow."
With 22 models, you can have 8 bows.

Rounding up its 0.5 + of a value, if was 7.5 or above up to 7.9% would be indeed 8, if its less than 7.5% srry but aint rounding to 8 as far as i know.
Its basic class grade test evaluation, you wont get 15 on your evaluation if you get 14,4 you only get the 15 note on a 14,5 + (that is called rounding up getting the half of something up)

quoting: " Rounding a numerical value means replacing it by another value that is approximately equal but has a shorter, simpler, or more explicit representation; for example, replacing £23.4476 with £23.45, or the fraction 312/937 with 1/3, or the expression √2 with 1.414. A wavy equals sign (≈) is sometimes used to indicate rounding of exact numbers. For example: 9.98 ≈ 10. Rounding a number y to the nearest integer requires some tie-breaking rule for those cases when y is exactly half-way between two integers — that is, when the fraction part of y is exactly 0.5."

WhoelsebutHaldir · **Posted:** Mon Jan 05, 2015 7:10 pm

Hmmmm, that's a bummer about the cavalry. I didn't notice that they only benefit with the new Thranduil profile. I might just replace them with palace guard with spear/shield then....I'll play test it first and then decide.

Also, concerning the bow limit, as far as I know you can have 8 bows if you have 22-24 regular warriors.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

WhoelsebutHaldir wrote:

Hmmmm, that's a bummer about the cavalry. I didn't notice that they only benefit with the new Thranduil profile. I might just replace them with palace guard with spear/shield then....I'll play test it first and then decide.

Also, concerning the bow limit, as far as I know you can have 8 bows if you have 22-24 regular warriors. 23/24 you mean as 23/3= 7,6% = 8 (rounding up) no wonder if you look at most people´s list they have been doing the rounding up wrong :P

Coenus Scaldingus · **Joined:** Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:14 am **Posts:** 1121

Although I am not well versed enough in English terms regarding arithmetics to be entirely sure on general terminology, I'm pretty certain rounding up can mean: to the next discrete number, regardless of being above or below the 0.5 mark.

That certainly is the case in e.g. SAGA, where Levy produce 1 attack die for every 3 models in the unit, and a single remaining Levy figure would still produce 1 attack die (rounded up from 0.3333333333etc).

WhoelsebutHaldir · **Posted:** Mon Jan 05, 2015 10:20 pm

Galanur, I know how rounding up works in mathematics. What I meant by my last post is the way I thought it was interpreted by most people (meaning people here) not how I myself interpret it. But for the sake of argument I will say this (despite my better judgement) if you are rounding anything in this game you would do it to whole numbers ALWAYS going up.

Like when calculating certain things in math problems e.g. how many things of X do you need to buy to fill a space if it is Y big and Y is not divisible by X into whole numbers So if you needed 23.019 of X to fill Y, you would need to buy 24 of X.

Going on that principle, if you have 22 men x 0.333333... = bow limit = 7.33326...... which you round up to 8 because you cannot have 0.33326... of an Archer.
So if you look at rounding like this then you can have 8 archers in 22 men. Its a small difference but for some reason people always get up in arms about it. idk why......

In any case it is a rather pointless debate, especially here because I only l have 6 Mirkwood Warriors with bow so going over the limit does not matter.

polywags · **Posted:** Tue Jan 06, 2015 9:28 am

After a little testing, I think this is what I would do at 500, I think its 500, its late and my math could very well be off lol.

Warband 1
Thranduil w/bow, w/cloak, /armor

4 Mirkwood elves w/ shields
4 Mirkwood elves w/ bows
2 MIrkwood elves w/ glaives
1 Mirkwood ranger

Warband 2
Legolas(not stat creeped)

4 Mirkwood elves w/ shields
4 Mirkwood elves w/ bows
2 Mirkwood elves w/ glaives
2 Mirkwood rangers

Warband 3
Tauriel

25 models, 11 bows + heroes, 9 might

Could go exile here and give Legolas armor since she isnt leading troops anyways but I like the bow. I think this is an ok list. I dunno if cheaping out on the glaives is worth it or not since you can get as many supports but they're just so damn expensive. I find a lot of time with elves you are just going to be shielding with most of your troops while sending heroes and a few troops to try to make a play. Anyways, I am hoping to give this a try tomorrow and see.

Thoughts?

WhoelsebutHaldir · **Posted:** Wed Jan 07, 2015 12:01 am

Idk about that one, it has a lot of good heroes and might but they are all fairly vulnerable. Especially Leoglas because you haven't given him armour or a cloak. There is also the low troop count which is not encouraging. However, you do have a really great selection of heroes so, provided they don't die really fast, they will make a big difference.

Let us know how the game goes, I for one am very interested to hear!

500 point Mirkwood

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