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| Serious tournament army. (Update choices page 3) http://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=30297 |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:03 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Serious tournament army. (Update choices page 3) |
Ok guys, Im going to a 750 pt tournament at the end of March, and here's pretty much the final set of lists I have come down to. The rule is 750 points, 20 models MAXIMUM. The scenarios are not set, but at the last tourney like this went as follows: -To the Death -Capture the hill(more models on central hill/leader also wins game) -Capture the one ring(its in the middle of the board and you have to take it off I believe your opponents edge) Army One-Heroes of the Hobbit Leader-Beorn Dwalin, Champion of Erebor (New) Thorin Oakenshield with Oakenshield (Original one) Saruman the Wise (New one) Alfrid Thranduil, King OWR(New one) on horse Strengths: Exceptional leader. Extreme fight value/Hard to kill army. Decent number of Units. High might. Weaknesses: Alfrid dieing. Its a huge portion of my break limit, but hopefully the extra might will help to protect him and the rest of the army. Lack of speed. Only Thranduil and Beorn move more than 6, and 2 units move 5.... Army Two- This one may be my favorite. Knight of Umbar on Fell Beast 9 Half trolls of Harad Dwimmerlaik on Horse 1 Barrow Wight 1 Mordor Troll Chieftan Strengths: Leader who can use magic, and also kill at will. Monster attacks. A lot of units, and a lot of killing power. Tons of magic, and the Dwimmerlaik cuts the enemy's might will and fate in half realistically. Barrow Wight will have the chance to paralyse units, because the wraiths will sap will. At the very least, he will be a pain in the ass for the enemy. The troll provides hero killing ability, brutal power attacks, and high defense to distract enemies. Weaknesses: Very low might, and low courage. If I break, the half trolls will flee immediately. Luckily, I can use stand fast, and also its unlikely for me to break against many armies that will probably show to this tournament. Id need to lose 7 units to break. Its possible, but the swarm method I believe will be too much to handle. Army Three- Witch King on horse, 3/20/3 4 Mordor Trolls(or replace this with 5 cave trolls instead with the same remaining list.) Dwimmerlaik on armored horse Barrow Wight Strengths: Very survivable leader. Somewhat mobile with the wraiths, and plenty of magic. Monsters, monsters, monsters. The trolls are hard to beat in combat, and hard to kill. Furthermore, theres 4 of them lol. Barrow wight can paralyse someone, and take them out of the fight. This will lead to better combat matches with the trolls choosing fights and having more of a chance to outnumber the enemy. Weaknesses: Low numbers, low might. Army Four: Witch King 3/17 /2 on armored Horse Bill the Troll Dwimmerlaik on armored horse 4 cave trolls Strengths: Decent Might compared to other evil lists, plenty of monster attacks, Bill has paralyse and an amazing stat line. Weakness: Cave trolls defense is low for a high point model, and low model count. ============================================ Further Notes: I know some of you will suggest an all elf hero army, and ive tried it. Ive had a game with the Twins, Legolas, Thranduil, Beorn, and Glorifindel..... It was alright, but they underpeformed. They won fights, and were mobile, all on horse....but they had no killing power. I havent thought of one with Gil Galad.....whom everyone seems to love but if I did it would be something like this: Gil on armor horse Twins on horse with heavy armor Saruman the New one New Thranduil on Horse Then I have 130 points left....so IDK As for other army ideas...Ive though of something with Boromir COTWT but besides him, Kingdoms of Men offer me nothing in a hero battle. And hes extremely expensive when good. To be serious contenders, he needs to upgrade to almost 200 points and at that level Id rather take a character like Beorn with power attacks, a higher defense, resistant to magic, etc So give me your thoughts guys. |
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| Author: | Lord Maedhros [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
I would say go for Army 2... And just as an aside the Mordor Troll cannot be his own Warband, he will need to be led by someone..... All three are very good lists Army 1 would be my second choice, however it has Alfrid in it so it may be a bit cheesy for my tastes. I understand he is in the Hobbit but you know why you put him in there  Although I will probably end up bringing alfrid in a non-Laketown army at some point I have actually never done that yet
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 4:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Lord Maedhros wrote: I would say go for Army 2... And just as an aside the Mordor Troll cannot be his own Warband, he will need to be led by someone..... All three are very good lists Army 1 would be my second choice, however it has Alfrid in it so it may be a bit cheesy for my tastes. I understand he is in the Hobbit but you know why you put him in there Although I will probably end up bringing alfrid in a non-Laketown army at some point I have actually never done that yet Usually I would only put Alfrid in an army with a warband of 12 guys from laketown, or a huge one with Bard and stuff...... the thing is, Im paying a bunch of money to attend this, its my only guaranteed tournament of the year in the US where I live, he fills points perfectly, actually, and finally.....youre only guaranteed 2 games. After, the highest scoring 8 players(or something to this affect) start an elimination tournament from there and Id like to play till I make it to the final four at least. Not only can he help with that, but I want to get my worth of games in. Not to mention, Lotr is so small by me now, the tournament is from 6pm to 11pm and I dont wanna be out till 12 at night just to play 2 games and leave.....you know. But Ive used him before and he got me 5 extra might. I had Thorin with 6 might....he was so powerful that game. By the way I took the KOU and changed his armored beast to a regular one, and took out one half troll. So now, I made it a Mordor Troll Chieftan which is even better, and 2 extra might!!! |
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| Author: | Galanur [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 5:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
I do like more the mighty of list 1... Although thorin, king under the mountain would be better for you (as you cann heroic combats) and keep the fight going like 2 fights a turn from the fights thorin hes part with. |
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| Author: | JamesR [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 5:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Go with army 3, but drop the BW for a shade and mount the WK and Dwim on FB's. You'll have to drop a troll to mount them, but it's worth it for sure |
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| Author: | Galanur [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
you want a fun at 750? gwaihir 2 eagles Radagast on eagle 2 eagles 5 woses Alfrid 5 monsters, 1 monster cav, 5 woses and alfrid. If anything like wormtongue show up... pick a random model with your eagles are fighting and throw the model at wormtongue, they say you can´t directly harm him, doesn´t mean you cant say oops... my bad, wrong place at wrong time :P |
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| Author: | ja33 [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Dude - Go with Elves ! Gil-Galad mounted w/shield Twins mounted w/Elven cloaks, bows and heavy armour Arwen mounted w/Elven cloak Glorfindel w/amour of Gondolin Erestor w/Elven cloak High Elf Captain w/bow & shield 7 models, 16 might, 750 points on the dot, I believe. Lots of Elven cloaks to protect you from arrows and a few bows on your side to shoot back, good mobility with 4 mounted heroes, and lots of very 'tough to kill' models. |
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| Author: | Glory4gondor [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
JamesR wrote: Go with army 3, but drop the BW for a shade and mount the WK and Dwim on FB's. You'll have to drop a troll to mount them, but it's worth it for sure I would like to see this list. I like one as well Beorn the f___ing bear! |
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| Author: | Glory4gondor [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Seriously though. What about this Warband 1 10/12 The Knight of Umbar with Fell Beast; 10 Half Troll of Far Harad ---- Warband 1 0/12 The Dwimmerlaik with Fell Beast; ---- Warband 2 0/12 Khamûl the Easterling with Fell Beast; ---- for 740 low might is an issue. |
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| Author: | Badner [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 6:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
I voted for list 1, because I think that Beorn is perfect at such tournaments, he is a perfect hero killer. I think you will have to play against a lot of Ringwraiths, so the new Galadriel should be very handy. |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
JamesR wrote: Go with army 3, but drop the BW for a shade and mount the WK and Dwim on FB's. You'll have to drop a troll to mount them, but it's worth it for sure Im always doen with mounting the Witch King on fell beast, but theres no way Im going to put the Dwimmerlaik with no might in a combat situation. I understand how powerful fell beasts are but he should not be in combat. Shade....yeah....I was thinking about that...Seems like a very good prospect. Ill maybe re do some numbers and write an army or two with him. Ill let you know. Thanks for the advice. Galanur wrote: you want a fun at 750? gwaihir 2 eagles Radagast on eagle 2 eagles 5 woses Alfrid 5 monsters, 1 monster cav, 5 woses and alfrid. If anything like wormtongue show up... pick a random model with your eagles are fighting and throw the model at wormtongue, they say you can´t directly harm him, doesn´t mean you cant say oops... my bad, wrong place at wrong time  No I dont want a fun one lol. And thats really, really far off from my lists. And personally I hate eagles. Sorry man haha  ja33 wrote: Dude - Go with Elves ! Gil-Galad mounted w/shield Twins mounted w/Elven cloaks, bows and heavy armour Arwen mounted w/Elven cloak Glorfindel w/amour of Gondolin Erestor w/Elven cloak High Elf Captain w/bow & shield 7 models, 16 might, 750 points on the dot, I believe. Lots of Elven cloaks to protect you from arrows and a few bows on your side to shoot back, good mobility with 4 mounted heroes, and lots of very 'tough to kill' models. Arwen is way too fragile in this tournament. She will get ripped to pieces. I already tried a similar list like I mentioned....it struggled to damage the enemy. Also, I doubt there will be much bowfire. A lot of Thorins company , Fellowship, monsters, and wraiths I assume. Glory4gondor wrote: Seriously though. What about this Warband 1 10/12 The Knight of Umbar with Fell Beast; 10 Half Troll of Far Harad ---- Warband 1 0/12 The Dwimmerlaik with Fell Beast; ---- Warband 2 0/12 Khamûl the Easterling with Fell Beast; ---- for 740 low might is an issue. I do like this list a lot.....the only issue is two things. I dont like Khamul. Id rather have the Witch King and like 2 less half trolls to up the Kings m/w/f/ The other thing....with paint and my trip, and other purchases I want to make, I dont think I really wanna own 3 fell beasts. I understand how good they can be, and we've all seen the channel where they can, no pun intended, beast.....but I dont wanna spend the money. If I get lucky on ebay I might get two at like 50 a piece but with the new releases(of which Ive purchased nothing) Im already going to be spending probably $250 soon. I also want other models in the near future. Tough thing, but thats part of the decision making as well. Badner wrote: I voted for list 1, because I think that Beorn is perfect at such tournaments, he is a perfect hero killer. I think you will have to play against a lot of Ringwraiths, so the new Galadriel should be very handy. Yeah....he is...hes going to be hard to kill and will murder a lot......Ive used him before in points matches a few times and he always helps a lot. As for Galadriel, I agree, she may become very vital.....but the thing is that spell is where she stops being useful. Her foritfy spirit is nice, but demands to much immobility in such small armies. And her stat line is good but I dont want her in combat anyway.... Either way everyone thanks for the ideas.....Im still considering them, even if I dont sound too keen on some of them. Any thoughts help. |
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| Author: | Frêrin [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
What about this little list: Ashrak 4 Dweller in the Dark 5 Venom-Back spiders/Bert Shade Gollum A F6 hero will need 2 points of might, to win a combat (heroic strike, modify 5 to be a 6). The spiders are there to surround all hero lists so the dwellers are able to kill them in on round. If you think this list is broken too easy take Bert instead of the Spiders. |
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| Author: | Badner [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 7:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Hi, I known you wrote that you don't like elves, however maybe you will consider this list: Galadriel Saruman Thranduil Legolas ( all from BoFA) Beorn Galadriel does not only have the fortify spirit, she has also banishment (I hope that is the English name of the spell) for the ringwraihts and she protects you from bows, which you were afraid of. She also causes terror and gives minus one on courage which protects her and Beorn from some normal troops. With the White council warband rule and fortify spirit (maybe even channeled), your army is almost resistant to magic. |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 8:08 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
A few things. No offense guys, but I mentioned at the start these are almost my finalized lists. I will either use these models, or something very similar in combo with things. For one, Im more comfortable, and two I own most of these or can get them easily. For example Frerin.....I dont have anything in your list besides gollum. Lol and I dont even know what the spiders and Ashrak do lol Badner wrote: Hi, I known you wrote that you don't like elves, however maybe you will consider this list: Galadriel Saruman Thranduil Legolas ( all from BoFA) Beorn Galadriel does not only have the fortify spirit, she has also banishment (I hope that is the English name of the spell) for the ringwraihts and she protects you from bows, which you were afraid of. She also causes terror and gives minus one on courage which protects her and Beorn from some normal troops. With the White council warband rule and fortify spirit (maybe even channeled), your army is almost resistant to magic. Im afraid of having two spell casters who cant do well in combat in the same army. |
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| Author: | Badner [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 9:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Okay, no problem. Just one idea: Maybe you can try out your first list into a test game and in an other game, you change Saruman against Gandalf. Normally I would say the new Saruman is better than Gandalf, however, Gandalf and Alfrid is very strong. Depending on your opponent and the scenario, you can generate something between 3 and extra might points, which is very strong. |
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| Author: | Galanur [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
750 tup to 20 models max hmm... Warband 1 "white Council" Saruman the wise Thranduil, King of the Woodland realm Warband 2 Thorin Oakenshield, King Under the mountain with orcrist Dwallin the dwarf, champion of erebor Warband 3 Beorn total 750pts might: 15 1 amazing cast and anti caster (saruman) 1 nasty horde dealer with lots of attacks (thranduil) 1 that call heroic combats every turn without using might and causes terror and D3 wounds to orcs/goblins and uruks (thorin) 1 nasty alot S character that chop chop stuff (dwalin) 1 very Nasty bear (beorn) |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Badner wrote: Okay, no problem. Just one idea: Maybe you can try out your first list into a test game and in an other game, you change Saruman against Gandalf. Normally I would say the new Saruman is better than Gandalf, however, Gandalf and Alfrid is very strong. Depending on your opponent and the scenario, you can generate something between 3 and extra might points, which is very strong. Thats very true. Good idea. No matter what happens, Ill probably try to give some might to my spellcaster just to see how that turns out. Sounds interesting. |
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| Author: | Badner [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Please let me know how this list performed, because I probably want to play a similar list. |
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| Author: | LordoftheBrownRing [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
Will do. I wont be able to test it for a while, but I will let you know. Im on a holiday but maybe in March I can schedule a game with someone. |
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| Author: | Sikano [ Sat Jan 24, 2015 11:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Serious tournament army opinion/advise. |
I feel like knight Umbar is THE way to go. You can expect heavy hitters on the other team with the rules and having the Knight of Umbar's mimicry is super nice to fight monsters with. |
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