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Isengard Trolls?
http://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=28228		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  TheBossman40k [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:20 am ]
Post subject:  Isengard Trolls?
Hey I've got a question. Cave trolls are S6 D6 yeah? The beefier Mordor trolls have been made larger, and given armour, making them 7-7, implying that the mods don't make them tougher enough to elicit a D increase. However the Isengard troll is S6 D8 which confuses me. The book says they have been moulded by Saruman to mimic the Dark Lord, but their wargear is listed as heavy armour and shield base. No matter how you look at it, would the naked Isenguard troll not be D5? How is that in any way tougher? Not even going to go into S. My best bet is that the number system is non-linear, sort of like the Richter scale (obviously not as steep). Please help.
Author:  whafrog [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
Some of the profile decisions are made with gameplay in mind rather than sticking with the hard and fast rules of what armour or shields do. Yes, the system is a bit Richter-ish, in that profiles don't always conform to cost expectations, and also there is very little wiggle room. Consider that D9+ is reserved for only the most legendary of armour (dwarves) or creatures (Balrog, Sauron, tough Dragons). An Isengard Troll doesn't fit there.
Author:  JamesR [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
Also perhaps consider that the "heavy armor" doesn't cover the model as well as an infantry would be. So perhaps it only covers a +1
Author:  TheBossman40k [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 9:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
Yeah I was pretty much thinking that. But if the latter of those comments is the case (which I had considered previously) then why give them Heavy Armour at all? The Mordor Trolls look just as armoured as the Isengard ones, and yeah I agree that in addition to it not fitting gamewise etc. But then why have that when giving them Heavy Armour was a stretch at best?

Oh well thanks for the replies guys :), I was kinda hoping that there would be a faq somewhere explaining or changing this but oh well :P.
Author:  Grungehog [ Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
Reasonably, no one could argue that any armour worn by a troll would not be heavy :P

But yeah I see where your going with this, maybe the rest of that defence was loaded into the C4, which makes these guys unusually brave for trolls
Author:  TheBossman40k [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:44 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
whafrog wrote:
Some of the profile decisions are made with gameplay in mind rather than sticking with the hard and fast rules of what armour or shields do. Yes, the system is a bit Richter-ish, in that profiles don't always conform to cost expectations, and also there is very little wiggle room. Consider that D9+ is reserved for only the most legendary of armour (dwarves) or creatures (Balrog, Sauron, tough Dragons). An Isengard Troll doesn't fit there.


I suppose I accepted that as that is the majority idea and my own as well, but then I came across Warriors of the Dead and Riders of the Dead. The Riders start with shields and are D7, and the Warriors don't and are D7. Would be fine... but the Warriors can take shields bringing them up to D8.
Author:  JamesR [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
TheBossman40k wrote:
... but the Warriors can take shields bringing them up to D8.


Which is incredibly stupid. They're incorporeal beings, shields, armor etc mean nothing to them. Not to mention they're not actually wearing armor. Its merely the "ghost" of what they once wore
Author:  TheBossman40k [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 6:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
JamesR wrote:
TheBossman40k wrote:
... but the Warriors can take shields bringing them up to D8.


Which is incredibly stupid. They're incorporeal beings, shields, armor etc mean nothing to them. Not to mention they're not actually wearing armor. Its merely the "ghost" of what they once wore


Well not technically. I'm not a super drugged up LOTR fan as I am with 40k, but I'm fairly sure the army of the dead were killable outside their cave. So not incorporal at all, just a certain balance of ghost and mortal. By your logic they can't kill anything either.
Author:  NarsilReforged [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 8:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
I don't think they do kill. They just terrify people.
Author:  TheBossman40k [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
NarsilReforged wrote:
I don't think they do kill. They just terrify people.


But in Return of the King they pull down all those Mumakil and all that. Thousands of orcs didn't get beaten just by being pansies, especially if they were the attacking elite.
Author:  NarsilReforged [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
That's the movies. I can't remember what it says in the books but definitely don't take what happens in the movies for fact.
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Isengard Trolls?
They didn't go to Pelennor Fields in the films, all they did was help to defeat the Corsairs before being released, so it it's likely they only used fear.

Also Isengard Trolls are Strength 6 because they are not Olog-hai, only Olog-hai are Strength 7, or at leas it was so until Bill & Bert.
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