Hello again all
I was alarmed to see that Isengard don't get much love on that 'best army' poll. I still love the look and theme of the army, and wanna go to battle with that force. How do people rate the units of Isengard? I plan to take Lurtz as a solid (if not spectacular) Close combat leader, an assault Ballista or two (To force the enemy to engage in Hand to hand combat), LOTS of pikemen (I'm new to the game, but the pikes seem to make better use of the game mechanics than standard warriors), and a troll or two (Chieftans seem to be worth the points upgrade). My mates and I were planning on playing up to 2000 points, which would let me take Lurtz and saruman, which'd be awesome, thematically, and also for the fact that's a close combat AND magic-centric leader in the force. but is this a bit unwieldy? It seems that 1000 is a recommended size, does the points balance break down a bit past that point, or is there another reason why 500-1000 points seems to be the 'sweet spot'?

Finally, I may well squeeze Amdur into the army (possibly replacing Lurtz, though thematically it's a bit lame). He seems like, hands down THE evil combat expert. But are there any tips people could offer regarding allies to help make up for the perceived or genuine weaknesses of Isengard?

Thanks all!

Personally, my main problems with Isengard are that they have too few Epic Heroes and, more importantly, their standard formation is too expensive. Compare a company of Uruk-hai to Warriors of Minas Tirith; the Uruk-hai have one more Fight, which is not a big deal, and one more Strength. Strength 4 can be good, but the majority of the time it doesn't make a difference to Strength 3. So, my point is, Uruk-hai cost 10pts (20%) more than Warriors of Minas Tirith, and all they get is two mediocre improvements.

I think most people will disagree with me here, but I'd take Uruk-hai with shields over pikes: the plus 2 Defence is worth more in my opinion.

The main reason why most players don't tend to go much above 1000pts is simply because they don't have enough models.

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"There are few left in Middle Earth like Aragorn, son of Arathorn." - Gandalf, Many Meetings

Hi Hydraface,

To give you an idea, here is what a mate runs at 1000pts - we do our best to give each others' armies a solid and sutained 'testing' , so I think it is a good example for a 1000pt list:

(The unit Shaman is IMO iffy, you are better off allying in Khadush, but we've peer-pressured the line that allying Non-Forgotten Kingdoms spellcasters is just sad, unless you are a learner - the player is not a learner. Personally, I would go for three more coy of warbands)

Saruman
'I can't believe it's not Thrydan' (an Uruk impersonating Thrydan, he inspires men by eating some)
4xShield Uruks (I agree they are more expensive than I'd like, General Elessar. However, str4 actually does help in a lot of matchups and they are still dead hard)
Ruin Shaman (Shatter shields and Dark Fury are both worthwhile at different points of the battle)
3xShield Uruks
3xcrossbow Uruks
5x 2HW Orcs
4x Feral Orcs

Essentially, if you can keep Saruman alive, you can do a heap of damage to the enemy with 2HW troops, xbows and Ruin spells, while Uruks with shields tend to hang around a lot. If you adopt a -_- formation with Shield Uruks to the front and xbows w Saruman to the rear, you can keep them firing while making it impossible to charge and duel out the spellcaster until they evetually flank the army or wear down the guys in the front.

It is always tough to beat that army. Its str 4 does a number on my Carn Dum army. I had to give in and put Aragorn into my Gondor army to beat it last time.

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http://www.roughwotr.blogspot.com

No pikes? They seem quite useful. Maybe if it's just a small formation or 2. I think it might be better to get a 4 c. formation of warg riders as harrasers or as suicide stallers. The shaman just needs one little hero to call a duel and you'll lose about a company of guys (if he used e. strike) what's more, the shaman can't move around so your formation will constantly be running from epic heroes. Just my 2 cents, though.

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"War does not determine who is right, only who is left."
- Bertrand Russel

He tried Pikes. As I say, we do our best to give armies a good solid testing. Compared to guys with shields, pikes are victims, and they don't bring what crossbows do to the table.

No arguments about the Shaman. Originally he was an allied Khadush, but I lent on my new evil player legitimacy to suggest we all agree to not be sad and cherry-pick the best casters via allies. None of us need the cheap boost, and if we all do it, it will end up at Druzhag and Khamul. In fact, he probably would have taken Druzhag in the first place if he had realised that Saruman couldn't keep feeding might to the Firecaller's Epic Ruination. If the shaman is allowed in the Orcs (NRBH), I think he might end up there using Dark Fury. Overall though, yes he is a duel target and I'd prefer some more Uruks with shields to forestall the point where the enemy works around flanks and doubles their chances to hit.

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http://www.roughwotr.blogspot.com

@hydraface, you didnt mention if you were talking about WOTR or SBG, but it seems like you are refering to WOTR, remember to say this in the title

Yah, my bad. I was referring to WotR. This was actually a seperate post that started off as part of another explicitely WotR post. I do like SBG, but WotR seems to be more to my taste. The posts have been very helpful though! I'm thinking that Battlehosts may be a way to get a little extra oomph out of my army.