Will GW release New LOTR (not hobbit) miniatures?

aelfwine · **Joined:** Sat Aug 22, 2009 12:23 am **Posts:** 508

Dr Grant wrote:

I'm by no means sure of the legal wrangling that led to this but you can see it in action in the Scouring of the Shire models. The 4 mounted Hobbits all look very different to their other sculpts and Sharky and Worm both have their faces obscured as GW couldn't use the actor's likenesses.

I don't know whether that was a decision on GW's part to not have to pay the fees or a stipulation from the license holder that GW couldn't use actor's likenesses for non-film scenes but it's interesting none-the-less

Spot on. For "Scouring" GW likely paid Zaentz and the Estate (names from Zaents, backstory from the Estate). Since Warners didn't really explore that bit of the universe, there was no point paying 'em.

Theodred · **Posted:** Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:48 pm

Looking at the way they do re-releases for complete collections in 40k & Warhammer (i.e. the upcoming new Tau miniatures - or so I read on another thread), there is potential for doing the same for LotR. Some of the most plastic popular boxed sets are as they were when they were released over a decade ago i.e. Riders of Rohan, TLA, Moria Goblins, WoMT, etc. I think if GW wanted to, they could make the SBG just like their other product lines but it would require some investment. I think the main question to ask is - are the key GW demographic still going to be as into LotR in 10 years time?

aelfwine · **Joined:** Sat Aug 22, 2009 12:23 am **Posts:** 508

I'd say GW are keenly aware of the whole "end of the LOTR bubble" phenonmenon from last time around. Hobbit merchandise sales will be probably be going over the cliff by late 2015. After that, there's no more anything on the horizon (barring something unexpected like a high budget TV series), so there won't be that mainstream market buzz.

At which point, if I were GW, I'd be planning some final "bump" for the line (The Total One Rulebook! :p) with a lot of push, and then leave the whole line to the fate of the market. Who knows, it might carry on profitably until 2021! Probably not, though. I'd say we'll see the range dwindle off around 2016

Which means the SBG will have had a 15 year(!!!) lifespan. For a licensed property? That's marvellous.

I can, however, imagine GW taking the SBG rules to adapt to some other property (Warhammer Strategy Battle Game anyone?) If they were really sneaky, they could retool the moulds for the old plastic dwarf warriors and the Morgul knights, things that aren't part of WB's visual canon and could easily be slotted into some other universe. (GW did this before with some of their old Middle-earth range, apparently)

But in many ways, this really should have been a ten-years-and-done range. It's just the Hobbit spent four years in legal limbo, and the SBG spent years in maintenance mode, a few releases here and there to keep the fans happy (and not enough to offend the WH partisans who seem strangely perturbed by the whole thing).

It's had a good run, and its not over yet. Let's just enjoy it while its going.

The Arkenstone · **Joined:** Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:12 am **Posts:** 94

As much as I'd like to see GW continue to support the SBG beyond The Hobbit years (i.e. 2015/2016), I don't think it's too likely given the declining sales and lack is visual evidence in GW stores with limited stocking of SBG products and no one actually plays, at least around here.

I'd expect GW to pursue another license after 2016 such as Star Wars or Game of Thrones, but they may just fall back to the WHF and 40K business.

I think I have enough minis to last me awhile at this point...

Pindergorn · **Posted:** Tue Mar 19, 2013 6:56 pm

The Arkenstone wrote:

I'd expect GW to pursue another license after 2016 such as Star Wars or Game of Thrones, but they may just fall back to the WHF and 40K business.

Oh GOD NO. I love Game of Thrones (2nd only to Lord of the Rings), I would not trust GW with the licence. While the miniatures would of course be amazing, they'd be overpriced, cast in a poor quality resin, support for the game would plummet the moment prices begin to dip, the rules would be written in order to drive sales as much as possible (power creep) with regular revamps forcing you to replace your obsolete books, and GW would have a monopoly on Game of Thrones (currently Darksword Miniatures produce miniatures based on the books).

The Arkenstone · **Joined:** Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:12 am **Posts:** 94

I checked out Darksword Miniatures site with the expectation that I was going to be disappointed. I couldn't have been more wrong. Wow! These are some really impressive and beautiful sculpts. Tom Meier is a tremendously talented artist!

Are they still producing new miniatures for Game of Thrones? I don't see a Khal Drogo, for instance. I might have to give some thought to investing in this line of minis, they are wonderous!

Pindergorn · **Posted:** Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:01 am

Yes, they're fantastic miniatures. My only gripe is that they're not based on the tv show - I'd prefer models based on the likenesses of the actors. Although, the best thing about them is that Darksword Miniatures work directly with the author George RR Martin. He gives them detailed info on how the characters should, so they are very true to the books.

My favourite model is Jon Snow - I might get him to use as a Ranger of the North (Aranarth, first Dunedain chieftan perhaps) but IIRC the scale is larger than LOTR, 32mm vs 28mm.

emre43 · **Joined:** Thu Jan 12, 2012 9:30 pm **Posts:** 176

There are still a lot of Fiefdoms models to release and then there are the Appendices. Like Helm Hammerhand, Fram and Snow Trolls.

Hirumith, the Grey Knight · **Posted:** Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:52 am

The Arkenstone wrote:

Are they still producing new miniatures for Game of Thrones? I don't see a Khal Drogo, for instance.

Well, I was going to say that they only seem to update the line infrequently, as I could only recall a handful of new figures since I discovered the line over a year ago, but they must have made several additions recently because I just checked and there are many figures in there that I don't remember seeing the last time I checked out the GRRM Masterworks, which was only about a month ago. So that would suggest that they are, indeed, actively supporting this miniature range.

RangerofTheNorth · **Joined:** Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:54 pm **Posts:** 483

Hirumith, the Grey Knight wrote:

The Arkenstone wrote:

Are they still producing new miniatures for Game of Thrones? I don't see a Khal Drogo, for instance.

Well, I was going to say that they only seem to update the line infrequently, as I could only recall a handful of new figures since I discovered the line over a year ago, but they must have made several additions recently because I just checked and there are many figures in there that I don't remember seeing the last time I checked out the GRRM Masterworks, which was only about a month ago. So that would suggest that they are, indeed, actively supporting this miniature range.

They have about 3-4 new ones released every couple of months lately.

Theodred · **Posted:** Thu Mar 21, 2013 1:05 am

I don't think GW will go for Star Wars or GoT - they've avoided SW over the past 20 years and there is a lot of licensing red tape. As for GoT, it's an adult aimed series (Certificate 18 in the UK) which is outside of GW key target segment demographic. That's not to say that they won't introduce something new. Given that LotR has been hugely profitable, well received and accounts for some of GW's best miniatures ever produced, I think it's most likely that it'll be made a Specialist Game after The Hobbit finishes. When I started the hobby, you could 'Mail Order' miniatures from a decade before in stores. They had this massive black binder you could flick through and pick really old miniatures (even ones that predated slot bases) and fill in the form (not sure if this still exists). That's another possibility.

The Arkenstone · **Joined:** Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:12 am **Posts:** 94

I mention Star Wars since Disney purchased LFL and they might be more reasonable and open to doing a licensing deal. Pure speculation but I'd think GW has the resources to pursue it if they wanted to.

I'm not really sure how good a tabletop wargame one could make from Game of Thrones. The books and show are more about political intrigue and alliances than battles, although there is certainly some of that. This is from the perspectivef someone who's only read book one and seen seasons 1&2 on HBO so maybe there is more war later on.

Oingo Boingo · **Posted:** Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:05 am

Game of thrones = fantasy porn

*puts tin hat on*

Oingo Boingo · **Posted:** Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:10 am

I think following the conclusion of the hobbit franchise there may be a flurry of releases just to keep interest peaked but i have no idea what will happen after that. I would hate to see it fall into the specialist game category and fall by the wayside with other classics like Necromunda.

I don't play 40k or fantasy so it annoys me a little that they would get priority but they are daddy's first born's so i can see why. If they keep it alive till about 2016 then that should give me enough time to get all the figures i want. Fingers crossed.

mikeland · **Joined:** Wed Feb 20, 2013 1:08 pm **Posts:** 72

Games Workshop will not touch Game of Thrones due to the high incident of 'R' rated material, they like everything to be just this side of 'parent friendly'.

I suspect they will just close down the third range altogether when the franchise expires and concentrate on using the space/resources to sell more space marines to 13 year olds.

The Arkenstone · **Joined:** Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:12 am **Posts:** 94

And how many kids/teenagers can afford to buy their products? They want their stores to be kid friendly, yet their prices are so far beyond the reach of most people in that age demographic that it won't matter.

I can't remember the last time I saw a kid (say under 15) in my LGS looking at anything other than card games and comic books.

Jamros · **Posted:** Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:03 pm

A few months ago when I was in my local GW, a father was there with his three young sons. The store owner was literally spending all of his time with them. They were prepared to (and ultimately did) spend all their meager allowance money on 40k boxed sets, with a little extra help from their father as well.

The denizens of the internet insist that this is GW's new target audience, but for the record, every other time I've been in GW it's been adults in their mid-20s spending loads on an army box. These guys are regulars there and are playing 40k every time I stop by.

I do find it hard to accept that the Warhammer Fantasy and 40k universes are all that family or kid friendly. GW has cleaned up Slaanesh the past few years, but anyone who's read well into the background would know Warhammer is not really for kids. At all. Besides the disturbing elements of Chaos, Warhammer is absolutely bathed in gratuitous violence. I understand there is money to be made in that demographic, but I can't understand how it would be selling well to them, assuming it actually is.

We criticize GW, but honestly, they seem to know just how much they can push their customers and what they can get away with.

I think it would be more likely for GW to retire the LotR and Hobbit ranges than make them Specialist Games. The licensing fees don't seem like they'd produce a worthwhile return if the game was reduced to the obscurity that's been granted to Warmaster, Blood Bowl, Mordheim, etc.

One thing I thought of though was the possibility of maintaining LotR but scrapping the entire range and starting over without film imagery. Every set would be produced based on GW's interpretation of the text, like Mithral Miniatures does.

The Arkenstone · **Joined:** Sat Feb 02, 2013 1:12 am **Posts:** 94

There are some gaps to fill in the existing range, but for me, the biggest thing I'd like to see is updated versions of some of the key models from the original releases.

Fighting Uruk-hai are about a head shorter than they should be, mordor orc plastics need an update or at the very least a kit with some options, and the original rohan and gondor warriors are pretty boring (but not all that bad of sculpts). If GW came out with a plastic Mordor Uruk-hai kit, I'd like pick up enough to build 20-30 models.

I'm not sure how much more GW can milk from this license outside of the upcoming Hobbit releases. Plastic Arnor, Lamedon, and Lossarnach warriors might be appealing but I'm not sure how much to the masses.

Theodred · **Posted:** Thu Mar 21, 2013 8:06 pm

The Arkenstone wrote:

And how many kids/teenagers can afford to buy their products? They want their stores to be kid friendly, yet their prices are so far beyond the reach of most people in that age demographic that it won't matter.

I can't remember the last time I saw a kid (say under 15) in my LGS looking at anything other than card games and comic books.

In the GW stores in West London (i.e. Kensington, Oxford St, etc), 10-15 year olds are clearly their main demographic. I guess they can count on the fact that parents will always spend money on their children's hobbies. Personally speaking for myself and my friends who used to be into the hobby, we did lose interest at around 16 or 17. We became much more concerned with MacBook Pros, iPhones, going out, getting a car and so on. At university and onwards, while people in that age group might have disposable income, they won't necessarily have the interest or time. I myself only paint/collect and haven't played a game in at least 7 years.

uruksdreamtoo · **Posted:** Sat Mar 23, 2013 12:38 pm

Any figure company can make characters from LOTR and the other works. They just can't use the Tolkien names for the figures. So, if GW stops making figures it will not really effect me at all. Some of the fan base has been brainwashed into the "if it's not GW you can't use it" mentality. Having been doing figure gaming for 40 odd years we used substitute figures all the time in the old days. The rules work the same with any figure makers miniatures.

Will GW release New LOTR (not hobbit) miniatures?

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