Spoilers - Battle of Five Armies, Beorn?

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 5:29 pm

So I want to now what you guys think about the chances of Beorn showing up in the final battle. I don't think we will see him there at all because of how little screen time he got in the second movie. Granted we didn't get all that much of him in the book and he still showed up at the end but it was a short book with a number of important characters not getting much time. Bard, the elven king and Dain were all pretty short but had big parts to play, but the movies have given both Bard and the elven king, even Legolas come to think of it, a good deal more development then Beorn.

I wouldn't been surprised if we see Legolas kill Bolg rather than Beorn. Legolas was chasing after him at the end of DoS with murder on his mind to be shore. Azog will probably just fight Thorin to the dead, Azog dies leaving Thorin mortally wounded to have his moment with Bilbo neat as neat. Maybe Dain could finish Azog off like he did in the book, if we even see Dain that is, but I think the established guys will do the killing. Because you don't build up a villain for three movies to have the big confutation with the heroes only for someone new guy to come in warp everything up.

What do you guys think? Have we seen the last of the bear, will he be a sixth army at the battle of five or will Jackson try shoehorn him in to the final battle with the necromancer instead?

halauas · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:12 pm

I actualy think we will see him again, or they would have skip the entire part on DoS if they didnt want to add a character (and that cool) that we wont see in action at all.

Legolas killing bolg? Agree, sadly i think aswell they will do something like that for the same reasons you mentioned.

As for Azog im not really sure Dain will kill him in the movie (according to marketing thorin must kill him this time as he failed badly in AEJ. But pretty sure Dain will have a good part in the movie as he needs to be pictured as the new king of erebor.

Sorry for my bad english

Dorthonion · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:21 pm

Beorn will appear and no doubt he will wreak havoc upon orcs, goblins, wargs and whatever else gets in his way. There is no point in speculating who kills whom as PJ and the producers could have put in any number of twists they like.

Goldman25 · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:47 pm

From the looks of things, Beorn will be appearing in both the Battle of Five armies and the siege of Dol Guldur. He'll definitely be appearing in the BoFA, Jackson wouldn't change that, and based on the Lego sets, Beorn appears at some point in Dol Guldur. I'm not going to make guesses about who kills who, Azog's survival in the first place throws that all out of whack. Of course we're going to see Dain, why wouldn't we? Billy Conolly's done interviews, saying how awesome Dain is. I reckon that Bofur, Fili, Kili and Oin will meet up with Dain first, and only re-join the rest of the company during the battle (if at all).

Delirivm · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:49 pm

I'm happy as long as Tauriel doesn't kill Azog/Bolg/Smaug

SubTukkZero · **Joined:** Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:38 pm **Posts:** 15

My hunch is that during the climax of the Battle of Five Armies Thorin and Azog will fight an epic duel and Thorin will LOSE, becoming mortally wounded, but Beorn will show up and just utterly break Azog. So in that sense Azog will play a similar role that Bolg did in the books.
Or maybe that's all just farfetched thinking.

Wise Old Elf · **Posted:** Sat Mar 15, 2014 11:22 pm

Even PJ doesn't have the heart to take such a crucial scene away from Beorn. I'll admit, he's not a character I have ever particularly enjoyed, I even sometimes skip his chapter when reading The Hobbit, but even I would be saddened if Beorn didn't get the chance to avenge his ancestors by slaying either Bolg or Azog. Speaking of which, this is probably the angle PJ will take, otherwise Beorn's few lines relating to how the Gundabad Orcs brought his kind to the edge of extinction in DOS would be completely useless and meaningless.

Tauriel will definitely die, that's for certain. For those that haven't read the book, look away now, my theory contains true plot spoilers. I believe Tauriel will be slain by Bolg, seeing as he has been linked with the Mirkwood Elves, and then, upon witnessing her death, Kili will rush over to avenge her. Unfortunately, as in the book, Kili will then be slain too, followed by Fili - who in turn rushed to defend his brother. Then, Thorin, realising his nephews have fallen will try to take on Bolg (PJ will obviously give Thorin the epic ending scene he deserves, and I think this would work well). Inevitably, after a big struggle, and possibly the Oakenshield being symbolically shattered by Bolg's massive hammer, Thorin would fall, and Beorn would step in to finish the battle.

On the other end of the scale - we have Azog, Gandalf, and potentially Beorn at Dol Guldur. We know Galadriel, Radagast and Saruman will turn up at the old fortress and have their fair share of the fight, possibly Elrond too although this hasn't been confirmed yet. So, while Thorin and his family are being torn apart at Erebor, I think the BOFA will be intercut with scenes of the White Council+Beorn's efforts to extinguish the Necromancer, which would mean a run-in with Azog. Personally, I think Saruman should put an end to this particular pale orc, not just because visually we have never seen the White Wizard's true power which would be incredible, but also because it would be a brilliant send off to Sir Christopher Lee. I mean this is the most polite terms, as I truly think he's the greatest actor to ever set foot on Earth, but with little left in him, I think his role in the Hobbit will be one of his final performances, if not his last, so it would be perfect for such a distinguished actor to go out with a bang (I'm not talking about his death either, when I say his last performance I'm speaking of his retirement).

These are my hopes anyway, but inevitably, almost all of them will remain little more than mere hopes!

SubTukkZero · **Joined:** Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:38 pm **Posts:** 15

Interesting theory, and I hope that idea with Saruman happens. Christopher Lee is my favourite actor and because of him Saruman became my favourite Middle-earth character; I'd love to see him kick some ass.
But I got the idea that Azog and the army of Dol-Goldur was marching off to Erebor at the end of DoS. Which may mean that Azog wouldn't be present when the White Council arrives.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 2:52 pm

Interesting theories to be shore, with the majority of you thinking we'll see Beorn in at least some capacity in the final movie. Not un expected given how popular the bear seems to be, even with that god awful mutton chop beard.

Dorthonion I admire you optimism in the skill of good old Peter, but were one man see's a plot twist another man may see a plot hole. I hope Beorn will show up but I still don't see it working well into what they have set up and I'd rather not see it done at all than have it done poorly.

Anyhow... Thanks for your input guys!

Xintao · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 3:29 pm

Good stuff in this thread.

Do you guys think PJ will follow the books and kill off Kili and Fili? I am torn on this one. They were made with younger kids in mind to like. My twin 16 year old daughters will attest to their "like-ability". And watching those live fan events, the audience was filled with young girls.

I can see PJ not killing these 2. Thorin will be heartbreaking enough, but to add in the "kid dwarves"? I think will be over the top.

Ok ok, PJ has a history of over the top scenes, cough,Goblin town, cough. But action sequences.

Again I'm torn on this. If I were shooting the movie, I would consider not killing them.

Can't wait to find out. Oh man will my kids be crying in the theater.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 4:45 pm

Yeah Fili and Kili will get axed, Fili especially. They'll have to die so Dain can take over the Lonely mountain. If either of them lived they would get crowned head of the house before Dain. That's why the prettied them up and gave them so much screen time anyhow, so all the young ladies will care when their heart throbs die.

As for making children cry well Jackson did that in the lotr's too with Gandalf's almost death in the first movie.

Sithious · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:03 pm

Interesting idea's here. Too bad that Thorin dropped his Oak shield when the eagles took him, so no chance of a shield shatter by Bolg. I am sure Thorin will have a new sword and a new Shield when he hits the BOTFA. At this point I even think the Arkenstone will be passed to somebody, and that the elven sword will not be placed on Thorin's Tomb... just rip up your copy of the hobbit now and forget that it ever was written then go see the third film (why did they push it out from being this summer, WHY!?)

JamesR · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:09 pm

If Kili dies doesn't that make Tauriel showing up and saving him pointless? Unless he has an epic dearth saving a comrade

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Sun Mar 16, 2014 7:41 pm

Well JamesR in the book the brothers die defending Thorin from Bolg's bodyguard, not that it matters in the movie. But I would say that the whole saving business was pointless since they are both like to die to make the villains seem more dangerous.

Wise Old Elf · **Posted:** Mon Mar 17, 2014 4:37 pm

The brothers might even die in Lake Town, hence their separation from the 'main' company. Oin and Bofur could well show up at Erebor and have to explain what happened to Thorin's ancestors, I could imagine Bofur doing that - he seems to me the only member of the Company at the moment who would be able to deliver such a sombre line, other than Balin of course, who is played to perfection by Ken Stott.

Subtukkzero = Likewise! Not only did the Saruman of the books make me realise the unfathomable greatness of LOTR/Hobbit, but Lee's Saruman in the films also made the trilogy for me!

Lord Hurin · **Posted:** Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:44 pm

I think PJ will have Legolas kill Smaug, then he'll kill Azog and Bolg both with one arrow. Then he'll slaughter the entire Orc and Warg army in a few minutes and proceed to kill all the Dwarves and Lake-Men, and possibly even Bilbo, Gandalf, Beorn, and what the hell, the Eagles too.

Because PJ's Legolas is the star of the movie. He should have just made an original story called "The Elf"

Wise Old Elf · **Posted:** Tue Mar 18, 2014 2:08 pm

Lord Hurin wrote:

I think PJ will have Legolas kill Smaug, then he'll kill Azog and Bolg both with one arrow. Then he'll slaughter the entire Orc and Warg army in a few minutes and proceed to kill all the Dwarves and Lake-Men, and possibly even Bilbo, Gandalf, Beorn, and what the hell, the Eagles too.

Because PJ's Legolas is the star of the movie. He should have just made an original story called "The Elf"

Couldn't agree more!! If it were possible for the narrative to extend to a full feature-length film, and were the 'Hunt for Gollum' fan-film not already been made, and PJ hadn't completely ruled out a return to Middle-earth, I could easily see him revive the franchise in a decade or so with a similar film detailing Gollum and Legolas' story arc in between LOTR and The Hobbit.

I don't know if anyone had played the classic 'War of the Ring' PC game, but even when I was seven I was completely captivated by the level where you're Legolas hunting for Gollum, I kept wishing there would be some mention of it in the LOTR trilogy, but sadly not. For the record, the Legolas in that game is also exactly how I imagined the Elf Prince upon reading the books - for those that don't know it, look it up online (YouTube has good play-throughs), it was fantastic!!

Sithious · **Posted:** Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:15 pm

Correct me if I am wrong, I though Aragorn and Elronds Son's that chased gollum. I remember being upset that they didn't mention that in the Rivendell section or when Gandalf is telling Frodo about Gollum.

Wise Old Elf · **Posted:** Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:04 pm

Sithious wrote:

Correct me if I am wrong, I though Aragorn and Elronds Son's that chased gollum. I remember being upset that they didn't mention that in the Rivendell section or when Gandalf is telling Frodo about Gollum.

That is correct, but I think Legolas had some involvement too if I'm not mistaken. I believe at some point Gollum was caught by the Mirkwood Elves gazing at his newly corrupt reflection in the Enchanted River that passes through the forest, wondering if it was the 'precious' that had changed him, or if it was an illusion cast by the magical waters. Legolas was among the Elves that ensnared him, and they took him to Thranduil who questioned his carrying of the Ring, or if they knew of it's whereabouts. I might be wrong, but I think this is what happened, correct me if not.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:54 am

You are all most definitely wrong, no offence. Gandalf got Aragon to help him hunt for Gollum before he was distracted by other tasks and left Aragon to the hunt. I don't believe the twins or any of Aragon's kin help much if at all. Anyhow Aragon caught Gollum so point after he left Mordor and took him to the closest safe house, Mirkwood to be held until Gandalf arrived. Gollum escaped from the elves after Gandalf interrogated him about the ring and Sauron. He did so by climbing up a tree when the elves let him out of his cell for a bit and wanting for a orc raiding party to kill his guards so he could leave.

Spoilers - Battle of Five Armies, Beorn?

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