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| Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles https://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=32882 |
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| Author: | mr. dude [ Thu Mar 23, 2017 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
Basically, can a Spider (or any future model with a similar "ignore terrain" special rule) end its move on traditionally unscalable terrain? Rulebook P28 wrote: [...]any surface that is sheer (such as a fortress wall) or where we cannot balance a model without the risk of it falling off, cannot be climbed. Shelob and Spider Queen Entries wrote: [Spider Mama] can move at full speed over any type of difficult terrain and ignores all obstacles [...] Giant Spider Entry wrote: Giant Spiders can climb on any surface, regardless of angle. Giant Spiders can therefore move at full speed over any type of obstacle [...] What this seems to suggest is that you can send Giant Spiders up a wall and leave them there untouched by your opponent until you're good and ready, but I'm not sure about the heroes. They don't have the "climb on any surface, regardless of angle" specification. Intuitively, it's a spider, it can. Read as written, how would you rule it? This came up when I did exactly that, hid my Shelob up a big rock wall for a few turns until Dain was busy, then she got in. |
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| Author: | Grungehog [ Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
I've sent my spiders up wall before... including battlements usually if they can't complete their move to a flat surface I just blue tac em onto the wall. |
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| Author: | jhk2005 [ Sun Mar 26, 2017 1:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
i've always taken it the same way as the flying rules ; ie: if your model is likely to topple off & break then it's 'no go' re: spiders hanging on to walls... depending on the height of the wall you could either move them to touch the wall base & then next turn climb / charge to the top as 1 move, the alternative (with exceptionally tall buildings is that the model remains where it is but has a marker next to it to show it is already climbing and then must finish its move the next turn. I think the wording of the rules is that spiders (or similarly ruled models - moria goblins) aren't supposed to be able to spend 2 or more turns stuck on the side of a building without moving. They either must climb up or down, not remain there indefinitely. |
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| Author: | mr. dude [ Tue Mar 28, 2017 2:36 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
I'm looking through the rules and FAQs again, there doesn't seem to be anything against going up unscalable terrain and lurking for a turn. The question mark remains as to whether it can stay indefinitely. There's no ruling either way about "standing still" while climbing or about not moving your entire allowed distance when climbing; I assume the intention of the rules is that a model must always look to climb as far as it can, but I can't really figure it out with these models as they are exceptions to the main climbing rule. |
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| Author: | jhk2005 [ Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
i think with these circumstances its a bit of a 'house rule' situation. If I come across situations like these with other players, I normally suggest a roll-off but then apply the result to future games. Its just the nature of a game like this that if they wrote rules for every possible situation, the rulebook will be 3 times bigger & 3 times more expensive... better not give GW ideas! lol! |
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| Author: | Wan Shi Tong [ Wed Mar 29, 2017 12:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Spiders and Unscalable Obstacles |
If the rules don't explicitly state that a model has to keep climbing once they start I don't see how it would matter whether they stay for 1 turn or 10. It's really just an extension of the rules of movement so it would follow that how far you go and when would be at the controlling players discretion. Like having a model sit in difficult terrain or on top of a wall or leaving them in a river. However, I think that the rules for the movement of the giant spider uses the "climb on any surface, regardless of angle" as a fluff intro to the rule. I say that because it says "Therefore" at the start of the next sentence which implies to me that the preceding statement was an explanation rather than a rule. Later on the rule states that the spider "ignores obstacles" rather than can move full speed over them too. Which can be a whole other can of worms depending on what you take "ignores" to mean. If I where a judge I would say what you did was completely expectable mr. dude but that is just because I think "ignores obstacles" means treat all surfaces as open flat ground while still respecting the "obstacles" geometry, including verticality. |
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