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WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
https://ww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=88&t=19447		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  thelordcal [ Sun Sep 12, 2010 2:18 am ]
Post subject:  WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Hey y'all haven't played in over a month when the store annoucned a new challenge board/escalation league starting up for this month. The first match is 400pts, the last is 1500. I'm playing a strongly themed Grey Company List with a ton of heavy cavalry and shooting.

400pts.

Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies
Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies

Knights of Minas Tirith - 120pts.
-Shields
-4x Companies

Warriors of Minas Tirith - 75pts.
-3x Companies

Elladan, Elrohir - 70pts.

385pts.

600pts.

Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies
Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies

Knights of Dol Amroth - 200pts.
-4x Companies
Knights of Minas Tirith - 120pts.
-Shields
-4x Companies

Warriors of Minas Tirith-75pts.
-3x Companies

Elladan, Elrohir- 70pts.

585pts.


800pts.

Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies
Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies

Knights of Dol Amroth - 200pts.
-4x Companies
Knights of Minas Tirith - 120pts.
-Shields
-4x Companies

Warriors of Minas Tirith - 75pts.
-3x Companies

The Grey Company - 195pts.
-3x Companies

Elladan, Elrohir- 70pts.

780pts.
Author:  Xelee [ Sun Sep 12, 2010 9:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Hi thelordcal, you might find that list a bit problematic at the low points levels. It is not very durable and bowfire is not quite effective enough in this gasme to hang a strategy on. Cavalry can work, but need strong melee backup to be all they can be.

I'd suggest you rework so the Knights of Dol Amroth are in your stage two, Knights of Gondor are in the Stage one and you add in a unit of three warriors of Minas Tirith. They could reallly make the difference in terms of screening the cav and then giving you more melee units to set up flank charges with.

I think you need to be looking to make the space for approx 200pts of heavy inf by 1500pts, at least. Given it's value vs cost, I think that you want to perhaps think in terms of less Rangers of Arnor by the end (stop at 4?) and be economical with the cav.
Author:  thelordcal [ Wed Sep 15, 2010 2:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Some interesting comments there about the infantry, i have used heavy shooting lists quite effectively especially against dwarves who tend to be rather slow. I am however going to go out on a limb and try and mix it up a bit and add in some heavy infantry. I'm thinking about allying in some dwarves to really add in some much needed foot punch to the list. I've Edited the above post with some of the smaller lists. See above!

At 1k Points:

Rangers of Arnor - 60pts.
-2x Companies
Rangers of Arnor - 60 pts.
-2x Companies

Warriors of Minas Tirith - 75pts.
-3x Companies

Knights of Dol Amroth - 200pts.
-4x Companies
Knights of Minas Tirith - 120pts.
-4x Companies
Knights of Minas Tirith - 120pts.
-4x Companies

The Grey Company -245pts.
-Banner of the King
-3x Companies

Allies:
Elladan, Elrohir - 70pts.

Total is 950pts. I've got some points to play around with, wondering what everyone thought of the list first then i'll fill in the rest with a captain or something.
Author:  spuds4ever [ Wed Sep 15, 2010 7:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Something is lacked in all your lists except the ones with the grey company haven't got an army leader. I would just take Faramir instead of the twins and lose a company of knights. Also, I would say your cavalry formations need some command options. Banners are very useful and so are captains but a banner would probably do. And in 600 points, I think it is too early to add in super elites like SKoDA. Swap them out I would for some normal KoMT and buy some command options as I said earlier. I know that you are looking for heavy cav army but that is a pretty ridiculously small amount of close-combat infantry at 800 and 1,000 points, I would drop banner of the king in 1K. But that's just me being critical. The rangers are a good size (2 companies seems to work for some reason) and it seems like a thematicly cool army. 8)
Author:  Xelee [ Wed Sep 15, 2010 8:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
I disagree about the command options. A captain would be just like painting a big red sign on the Cav (not so bad on foot) that says "Epic Strike me and win the combat" and the banner seems a bit of an indulgence given it represents another full company of troops. Faramir has four might, since the army will be fighting as a tight unit anyway, he can just jump around units and use might for charges etc.
Author:  spuds4ever [ Thu Sep 16, 2010 11:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Xelee wrote:
I disagree about the command options. A captain would be just like painting a big red sign on the Cav (not so bad on foot) that says "Epic Strike me and win the combat" and the banner seems a bit of an indulgence given it represents another full company of troops. Faramir has four might, since the army will be fighting as a tight unit anyway, he can just jump around units and use might for charges etc.


Captains are often not worth duelling. On paper, it seems very logical to epic strike-duel them but most players find a better way to use 2 might points. And with banners, it's often better to buy a banner than being obliged to spend precious might points to extend the charge range drastically. Having another company of cavalry isn't going to help when they mess-up their charge and then are charged by a bunch of angry infantry with a powerful epic in the mix. And with Faramir, I think that one epic hero is not enough for that job, if he had several or allied in Erkenbrand, Eomer or some other fairly cheap epic, I wouldn't bother with the captain, but as it stands I would myself.
Author:  thelordcal [ Thu Sep 16, 2010 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
I've already considered doing some heavy reworking of the lists so that Imrahil was my main leader, and i allied in Eomer and some more riders of Rohan, at 1500 Aragorn would come in and do what he does best, and i'd have 3 incredibly strong heros to wreck face... The only problem is at the smaller points game, i think i'd rather Eomer over Faramir, just for funsies to hang with the escalation league feel.
Author:  Xelee [ Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Spuds4eva, if I saw a captain in a cavalry unit, and there was an ES hero in my list, I'd make sure he was was there to duel out that Captain. Too much of a juicy target to miss. You could cripple the Cav before they even fought. That's a bargain for 'precious might points'. If you are using the Cav properly, the only might point you need for the charge, is when you roll a 1. It all comes back to the fact that it's never just the one banner in a list, it ends up being two or three and that's pretty much another formation of Gondor troops or an Epic Hero right there, I know what I'd rather have.

In this game, people start off guarding their flanks pretty well, so you need to punch a hole and then let your Cav loose once you have done that. This means that the cav will be close in, and you units will be up in the enemy's face halving their move distance and threatening flanks if they turn too much. If you want to race up and smash something from the front, you want something like Axemen of Lossarnach.

thelordcal, Imrahil definitely has his advantages as your cheap hero, not least the fact that he has 'Epic Challenge' for pinning down Spellcasters/Wraiths so you can duel them.
Author:  thelordcal [ Fri Sep 17, 2010 12:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Played my first game last night vs. dwarves. I brought the 400 pt list there except i dropped the shields on knights elladan, elrohir, and brought in Faramir. My archers took out his shooting threats, he had some dwarf warriors with bows and a ballista, then i merely advanced towards his remaing dwarf warrior regiments. Bowfire saw them softened up, then he turned to take my cavalry in the front and my men of minas tirith got the flank charge. Overall a fun game and i'm proud of the list that i had out there. Thanks Xelee for the convincing argments to bring those men of minas tirith instead of the knights.

cal
Author:  Xelee [ Fri Sep 17, 2010 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Good to see you doing well with the force. The Gondor list is all about learning to play the army as a whole, since you can't lean on the cheap combos available to the Evil forces like Mordor (even my Carn Dum, to an extent) etc.

I love the look of a good WOTR cav army as well.
Author:  spuds4ever [ Sun Sep 19, 2010 10:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
Xelee wrote:
Spuds4eva, if I saw a captain in a cavalry unit, and there was an ES hero in my list, I'd make sure he was was there to duel out that Captain. Too much of a juicy target to miss. You could cripple the Cav before they even fought. That's a bargain for 'precious might points'. If you are using the Cav properly, the only might point you need for the charge, is when you roll a 1. It all comes back to the fact that it's never just the one banner in a list, it ends up being two or three and that's pretty much another formation of Gondor troops or an Epic Hero right there, I know what I'd rather have.

In this game, people start off guarding their flanks pretty well, so you need to punch a hole and then let your Cav loose once you have done that. This means that the cav will be close in, and you units will be up in the enemy's face halving their move distance and threatening flanks if they turn too much. If you want to race up and smash something from the front, you want something like Axemen of Lossarnach.

thelordcal, Imrahil definitely has his advantages as your cheap hero, not least the fact that he has 'Epic Challenge' for pinning down Spellcasters/Wraiths so you can duel them.


2 might isn't worth it for what, 2 cavalry models dead IMHO (that's what you would get on average if you had epic strike duel vs a f5 captain). And what you're saying about the flanks, the captain helps that as well to get at the doubles! it also can get you the vital heroic charge.
Author:  Xelee [ Sun Sep 19, 2010 11:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: WoTR Escalation League Gondor/Grey Company Themed
That's not all that happens as a result of the ES duel though, Spuds4eva, work through the rest vs not calling the duel. It's definitely worth it.

For Gondor (sneaky use of eg Gandalf excepted) the most reliable way to work flanks, and guard your own, is the way thelordcal did. Ultimately, I don't think anyone argues that Captains, banners etc don't do good things. However, they are not the only, nor even nearly the best, nor the most cost-effective way to do them.
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