Saruman's smelly pits

Ritcherd · **Posted:** Thu Jun 30, 2011 9:05 pm

Alright, question here that has just come into my head as i'm wandering the forum.

Go easy on me. I've watched the films (Lord of the rings of course) but I am ignorant of the books (i've tried to read them, I got as far as rivendell in the fellowship of the ring). I guess my question is this:

How did Saruman breed the Uruk-hai? Is it ever explained in the book? Is the Peter Jackson's interpretation the same or slightly different, or maybe totally different?

It's something that has always perplexed me

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:35 pm

In the booh uruk-hai are just great orcs- they are the strongest orcs. Although there are also half-orcs which are bred from dunledings and orcs.

Ritcherd · **Posted:** Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:41 pm

so in the book he doesn't spawn them from pits?

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:41 pm

General Elessar · **Posted:** Fri Jul 01, 2011 4:08 pm

Tolkien doesn't specifically mention how the Uruk-hai were bred. I personally don't think that they were spawned from pits, but that's just my opinion.

Ritcherd · **Posted:** Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:49 pm

I guess it's just one of those mysteries

spuds4ever · **Posted:** Fri Jul 01, 2011 8:24 pm

When reading the title of this topic, a picture of Christopher Lee without a top and a green odour rising from underneath his arms came :rofl:

.

Anyway, on topic. I don't see why the uruk-hai wouldn't be bred in pits. If they are great orcs, then surely they can't be made in such a different way. Also, I don't see how else Saruman would make them. It's not as if there are conveniently 10,000 strong orcs wandering about waiting to find some master and the area around Isengard I imagine would be too small to create an army of 10,000 and more (Isengard didn't look that big when you get a view of it after it's been flooded but maybe Tolkien intended it to be larger). I think it's quite a cool idea myself but I guess it's quite a lot down to opinion.

Papa Hoth · **Posted:** Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:39 pm

Yeah, the pits are not mentioned in the book; pits are however mentioned in the Symarillion(?) and tLoR as being a feature of Thangorodrim and/or Angband, JRRT doesn't mention them being breeding pits though.
Speaking of orc breeding,it seems as if young Saruman got it right...If one is going to all the trouble to breed orcs, why would one simply not breed mostly uruks with a few warg rider capables and some scouts? Why bother with bog standard, garden variety orcses? Are standard orcs cheaper by the dozen to produce?

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Sat Jul 02, 2011 1:04 pm

Because orcs can, if i'm not mistaken reproduce on their own, as can uruks, and they're needed for menial labour. Pits refers to the pits Morgoth use for breeding alllsorts, not just orcs, but trolls, spiders, krakens, giants, dragons etc. Sauron and Saruman do not, I think, create orcs in the same way, mostly, they let them breed with each other.

Morgoths_crown · **Joined:** Thu May 27, 2010 10:53 pm **Posts:** 161

It is important to remember that Tolkien stated that not only did the Orcs breed in the manner of the Children of Illuvatar, they also come in a variety of sizes from the Uruks (meaning Orc but used to mean the largest of the orcs) right the way down to the Snaga's or lesser Orc slaves as the Uruks called them. Tolkien never revealed how Sauron created the Uruk-Hai and and, as Treebeard suggests that Saruman may have blended the race of men and orcs but of course he could also mean the Ruffians. However, I quite like the notion of breeding an Orc from the ground as it suggests Tolkien's writings of the 'Maggot folk of Mordor', suggesting in turn a Norse mythology approach to the creation of a race!
However, I would recommend the 'Fighting Uruk-Hai' chapter from the Two Towers for all your Uruk-Hai needs!

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Sat Jul 02, 2011 10:10 pm

Morgoths_crown wrote:

It is important to remember that Tolkien stated that not only did the Orcs breed in the manner of the Children of Illuvatar, they also come in a variety of sizes from the Uruks (meaning Orc but used to mean the largest of the orcs) right the way down to the Snaga's or lesser Orc slaves as the Uruks called them. Tolkien never revealed how Sauron created the Uruk-Hai and and, as Treebeard suggests that Saruman may have blended the race of men and orcs but of course he could also mean the Ruffians. However, I quite like the notion of breeding an Orc from the ground as it suggests Tolkien's writings of the 'Maggot folk of Mordor', suggesting in turn a Norse mythology approach to the creation of a race!
However, I would recommend the 'Fighting Uruk-Hai' chapter from the Two Towers for all your Uruk-Hai needs!

That's what I meant when i said they could reproduce on their own, I also mentioned half-orcs.

Saruman's smelly pits

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