Same story, my local Games club play Warmachine and Hordes, much cheaper than GW, made in USA i think.

Problem is, people like me are LOTR obsessed, what ever GW bring out I will buy, even though its expensive. But compared to other hobbies and the fact i dont really drink or smoke i dont mind spending my money on it.

Take the recent Grim Hammer Captain, £1 2 took me 4 hours to paint, £3 an hour not including a small amount of paint. Cheaper than renting a DVD or an Xbox game that the average campaign being around 8 hours long!

Dont blame you for getting into Warmachine, it is a very nice system with good models and a good set of rules.

(sorry for getting off subject )

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Harfoots-The first of the Hobbit people to cross over the Misty Mountains and enter Eriador.

That sums it up for me, plus I'm not interested in other genres. Warmachine is worse than WHF or 40K to me, aesthetically. GW is lucky they got the Tolkien IP, whoever had it would get my cash (assuming similar quality). It helps that the SBG game mechanics are simple and solid, otherwise I'd have never bothered.

Eh, videogames are excellent value for money, and they've been by and large recession proof. They cost £40 at launch in 2006, and you can still buy them for £30-£40 new. If you play a game a decent amount, you can expect a good 10-15 hours from it at least - I've put in more than 100 on Mass Effect, Skyrim and Fallout, and I've put in 14 days on World at War - that's 10p an hour. I think £2-4 an hour is more than reasonable for the average gamer, especially considering you can wait a year for the 'Game of the Year' version, with extra content, for usually £10-15.

GW never have a sale, and their prices keep on rising. The killer for me was £50 for the rulebook; when I started, £40 for 48 Minis, dice and a rulebook was good value for money (RotK). The jump is astronomical.

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Namarie

I'm with Shieldmaiden. Good quality video games are better value for money than Gamesworkshop, hands down.

I still play Skyrim and Battlefield 3 a lot (both 1 1/2 years old), Half Life 2, Stronghold Crusader, Rome Total war, the original Star Wars Knights of the Old Republic, I just recently preordered the re-release of Age of Empires II (HD Edition) on Steam (my original disk broke).

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My (more regularly updated) painting blog:
https://www.facebook.com/Pindergorn/

hmmm but 15 hours of video gaming leaves you with nothing but sore thumbs, square eyes and a headache whilst 15 hours of painting one of GW's fantasticaly overpriced miniatures leaves you with a nicely painted model for your collection

No contest

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Commission Availability : BOOKED SOLID (again lol)

More of my work at

www.ShadowandFlame.co.uk

Better value for money than Gamesworkshop, I said.

Of course, the miniature wargaming hobby in general is ultimately more fun and rewarding than videogames.

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My (more regularly updated) painting blog:
https://www.facebook.com/Pindergorn/

I think there is a real value in video games, but I don't think I could say what has a higher value (Wargaming or Video Games)

One of the advantages I would give to miniatures is that when everything is said and done you have a product that you can showcase. A quick example: I am close to 600 hrs logged into Dawn of War 2, as the game wanes in popularity it soon is going to be unplayable. When it is gone, I am not to have anything to represent the investment I have made into the game. On the other hand, I have more than got my moneys worth out of game. Another game like Silent Hunter 3, is single player, and who know how long I will continue to play it.

I also don't feel guilty spending an entire weekend building terrain, gaming or painting. Where is the same can't be said about a day playing video games...

Video games and the GW hobby are two totally different things. You cant simply say I get more hours out of this therefore it is better value for money. It's about how you enjoy that time. A person who loves to run for 3 hours a day could say I don't spend any money doing it, therefore what I do is better value for money than what you do. So it is not a good way of comparing two things.

They won't win many new customers from video game community but will lose alot to their wargaming competitors. Ebay for me from now on.

Meanwhile I bought my first ever non-SBG minis yesterday (two warmachine models and some p3 paints). I feel exhilarated and slightly guilty at the same time - as if I'm being unfaithful to GW!

Just chiming in regarding the Australian Prices compared to the UK/US. I had a lengthy conversation with a GW Customer service rep at the warehouse when they were trying to resolve an ongoing Finecast stuff up for me.

Long story short, GW set Australian and New Zealand prices based on the 'expected' value of the Aussie/NZ dollar. That is to say approximately 1/3 of the GBP.

Never mind that our dollar has been consistently strong for YEARS and shows no sign of weakening against the GBP or the Greenback. When I pointed this out to him, he agreed, but said there is nothing they can do about it, as the prices are set by GW UK.

Now, if you contact GW UK (I did) and ask about the pricing in Australia, they will respond and say they have 'nothing' to do with that part of GW Oz and to contact them for further information?!?

I did notice that the GW box sets in Australia now sport a 'produced in Australia' sticker. Last time I checked, GW stock was all imported...

GW is also dancing very close to 'price-fixing', a practice which the Australian Govt. all but stomped on in the 1970s and are now attending to again in the wake of the digital millennium retail pattern shift.

As for my stance in the latest step in GWs road to self-destruction, I made a concious decision to stop buying from GW direct last year, because a)the prices were too high and b)I couldn't buy a Finecast model that wasn't rubbish. Their customer service department couldn't even supply a replacement figure that wasn't faulty in exactly the same way!

Given the appalling quality of Finecast, there isn't a lot I would want to buy anyway.

I'm not going to get rid of GW stuff that I currently own. I will continue to enjoy it. I just won't be wasting money on inferior product at inflated prices any more. This is not a boycott, or a rant (well maybe a little rant:)), it's an informed and considered buyer decision.

Life's too short to be worrying about when GW will actually get their corporate act together. There are plenty of other miniature manufacturers and heaps of new game systems to try.

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Cheers
Athelas

Whether a box of miniatures or a computer game are better value for money is completely subjective. My point was that I wonder whether their price strategy was based on the fact that their target new customer market seem to be able to afford £30-40 games reasonably regularly.

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*5th in 2014 GBHL

World At War!!!!

But don't forget about the BFME series, it was fantastic, and prior to my GW days that was how I satiated my LOTR addiction.

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Fight! Fight to the last man!

If this was to be our end then I would have them make SUCH AN END as to be worthy of remembrance

I am a big Total War fan and I have always wanted to get the LoTR mod "Third Age" working. It is an amazing mod but I am just terrible when it comes to mod's and such.

Here is the link to it if you haven't heard of it
http://www.moddb.com/mods/third-age-total-war

It a full conversion mod for Medieval 2.

First, I may be repeating some of what has been said here already, as I only did a quick read through everyone's opinions thus far, forgive me if I am repeating what has already been said...

As the former operator of a store that was selling GW products as an 'Independent Retailer' in a brick & mortar storefront as well as online in back when the first US regulations came into place in 2003, I can tell you what it means from a former-retailer's perspective. In 2003, we were in a position where most of our GW sales were online by a fairly decent margin. They sent the notice about the policy changes, which further explained the legalese, and it came down to this: If you sell GW products online in a shopping cart kind of store (especially with pictures of the products!), and GW found out, you run the risk of being dropped as an independent retailer to be able to buy direct from GW, as well as preventing you from being able to order GW products from the few US distributors that carry their products.

The problem was that GW was creating their own competition by allowing stores to buy their products directly at set discounts, and thereby allowing these stores to sell the products online with steep discounts while the GW site and stores try to sell the stuff exclusively for full retail price. Independent brick & mortar stores can afford to make smaller profit margins while increasing the number of unit sales by pricing the products competitively. GW doesn't want to hurt their own stores by discounting the prices online, because then their stores are effected because everybody would be ordering their products online. Their only real recourse is to do whatever they can to prevent retailers from offering the same items at huge discounts. This is their solution....

The concern to the greater, international wargaming community is, if this is the way GW is looking at their sales model, and they think that this has been a 'success', it's only a matter of time before it is pointless for any independent retailers to carry their products regardless of continent, and everything will eventually be sold exclusively either online from them for full retail, or in the GW Hobby Centers and Battle Bunkers - also for full retail. Basically, if they sell and ship their products to an independent retailer for a set discount, and they then turn around and sell it for the retail price, that retailer makes the net profit from the sale. If they sell it all online or in a GW store, all the profit stays in-house.

My biggest issue is, if they were opposed to retailers selling their products and making money that they clearly think should be all theirs, why start a retailer system and offer your products through wholesale distributors at all?

I ended up buying our entire GW inventory (and signs, displays and posters, and ummmmm *cough* stuff...) for what we paid wholesale out of my own pocket, and withdrew our status as a reseller from the "Independent Retailers" section of the GW website. We still use all those distributors for other gaming products, but GW is no longer sold there as of the day the 2003 regulations went into effect. This is just one 10,000 square foot new and used bookstore that no longer advertises their products on their store shelves, thereby preventing hundreds of unique shoppers a month from being exposed to the hobby who may never otherwise find themselves in a more dedicated 'Game Store', much less a GW Hobby Center. Their loss, I say...

T

Its our loss too, because with few new players coming into the hobby, and scores of people quitting the hobby, we have fewer opponents to play with and the game in general suffers.

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My (more regularly updated) painting blog:
https://www.facebook.com/Pindergorn/

I am finding the contary...lots of new players but the standard is poor.

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12th GBHL 2013.
13th GBHL 2014
9th GBHL 2015


Mid Sussex Wargamers

To add fuel to the fire, rumors are coming in that GW will no longer be allowing 'Open Gaming' in their Hobby Centers, and their game tables will be reserved specifically for GW-organized, scheduled events...

I am hoping to confirm this now (or not). With Indy Stores closing across North America, and GW Stores catering more and more to getting new gamers into the hobby, and then sending them away to play with their new expensive toys elsewhere, I am scared that the trend is only going to continue. To me there is nothing like getting to see two well-painted armies battling over a terrained and detailed battlefield to draw new players into the hobby. I know they are trying to re-invent their business model, and their focus is selling miniatures, not providing a place for players to play their games. It seems that running the veteran players off would not be in their best interest...

T

Hmmm THe stopping open gaming is alarming. I have always defended GW's prices by saying that it is because they provide ov er in store services that other companies don't which is why their prices are higher to fund that.

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http://www.talesofmiddleearth.co.uk

To put things into perspective, one GW is ending open gaming, while (supposedly) also increasing structured events and promoting local clubs as a venue for gaming once someone has "outgrown" the intro lessons provided by a GW store. Also, they said that the planned events will be diverse enough that there should be something for everyone.

Read the post here.

I guess we'll have to wait and see just how well GW sticks to their guns, and if that store actually offers suitably interesting and diverse games for people to play. I assume that even if open gaming is no longer happening, people who come in for the planned games will get to use their own minis and armies, so in that sense GW is still providing you a place to use your models.

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Well, that's my 2 cents.

My point of view is that they should make sure they are happy with the profit from wholesale transactions to retailers if they are going to offer it in the first place. If its an issue of not making enough money to trade accounts then fix that issue straight-out. I can't really expand on this point though as GW's policies and logic is just random to me, I can't predict what they'll do next and to me the whole situation feels a little unstable compared to the majority of other suppliers.

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My Wargaming Store: http://www.greendragongames.co.uk
10-25% off LOTR.

- Model Painting Service also available.