Hello all,

I've started with this hobby when the first LotR films were being released and have built up a fairly large collection of miniatures over the years. I mostly just collected and played games. I did always paint all models but didn't give it much care and the results weren't anything to show off about.

Now, I'd like to dive back into the hobby and have already bought a lot of new models. This time though I'd like to spend a lot more time and effort in painting these models. I have a lot of spare miniatures that I can improve my skills on so that is not the problem. One problem is though, that I've already painted a great number of plastic and metal models in the past to a pretty horrible standard.

1. I'm interested in stripping these models, I believe this should be relatively easy for metal ones? Should I use nail polish remover with or without acetone? And is there a good (and cheap) way to strip paint of plastic models without damaging the model?

2. Where do I start with painting techniques? I'd consider myself a complete beginner. Are there any links to places with a helpful guide for someone like me?

3. I've never based my models in the past because I was always afraid it could potentially be a bad fit for the surroundings. However I changed my feelings about this, a good looking base will look good regardless of the style of terrain. Again, is there a link that could help me as a complete beginner with basing?

Thanks in advance, I've bought some new models that I am very interested in painting to a good standard but understand it will take time to develop the necessary skills. Therefore I'd like to start practising as soon as possible, but as my history shows it doesn't matter if you paint 1 or 1000 miniatures if you don't learn any new techniques. I'd really like to step up my game but have no idea where to start.

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For scenario and campaign playthroughs, visit https://aiwendil.net/

Some of the others will be able to give more comprehensive responses (and provide links: I'm afraid I just don't know any, and don't want to just link you a googled link like I have a clue what I'm going on about), but I'll give answering a go:

1) If you're in the UK, brown Dettol strips both plastic and metal without damage. Just soak overnight and then take a toothbrush or something to the model to strip off the gunge that was once paint. In the States, Simple Green (I think...) is the brand name I've heard bandied about. Elsewhere, I'm not sure, but potent disinfectant seems to be a general guideline.

2) Most basic of tips is this - thin your paint. It's far easier to put another layer of paint onto a model than it is to remove a layer of paint so thick you could sell it to a plastics factory for profit.

Start with an undercoat - black or grey is good for beginners, as any mistakes (and there'll probably be loads at first) just end up looking like shading. Spray it on with an aerosol.

Or, get an aerosol of a colour that's prominent on the models (my Uruk Hai got a dose of brown spray instead of a black undercoat, having lots of brown skin. This got followed by a watered down silver that left some brown showing on the edges, suggesting rust on poorly maintained armour.), and then fill in the details. Try to be as neat as possible, and water down your paints a bit. Then once it's dry hit the model with some 'shade' paints (GW sells some, but other brands sell them too). These paints are VERY watery, and run into recesses to provide depth, shading and tone (My uruks got the black Shade over the metal, and brown over the flesh and rags. Worked out well enough, got about forty done in a day with zero effort.). From there if you're confident enough you can go in and paint slightly lighter shades of the colours already on the mini (I moved straight to basing my Uruk Hai, as I was in a rush, but I can always go back and highlight - I'd just paint the raised bits of muscle and flesh in a lighter brown, suggesting light hitting it and giving further depth and definition).

3) The simplest base would be PVA glue on the top, and then dunk it in some static grass. Shake off, and it looks like a grassy surface. With a bit more effort you could PVA sand down, paint the sand an earthy brown, and pva some static grass in clumps for a more natural look.

If you're concerned about it looking odd on some surfaces, well that's always a risk. I could have the best bases in the world but if they're snow effect and I play on anything but snow then it'll look jolly daft. My advice would be, at first, to stick to a fairly simple and common theme - the aforementioned grass or earth with grassy clumps. It'll look good on most surfaces. Also, keep to fairly neautral colours for the rim of the base. Browns are effective, suggesting earth and helping tie the model to the tabletop better. I go for black these days, because both I think it gives a better look, and also because if the rim of the base is black, then it'll go alight next to grass/stone/ice/whatever, regardless of what I do to the top of the base.

Thanks, that's very helpful! I'll see if I can track down some brown Dettol over here.

I do own some shade paints but only acquired them quite recently and never used them before so I'm looking forward to trying them out. I've just watched a couple of YouTube tutorials detailing the general steps of painting which seems to be in line with what you wrote, I think I have done like half the work on most older models. Hopefully this means I won't have to strip all of them but can just continue the work I've done on some models. There's only one way to find out really.

As for the basing, that's good advice, I'll probably experiment a bit with the grass and sand as I think they are the most versatile terrain wise and generally look quite good.

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For scenario and campaign playthroughs, visit https://aiwendil.net/

Let us know how you get on!

If you're using the GW paint system, it's actually well organised for beginners. The paints come as "Base" paints which are high pigment paints. Stick these straight over the undercoat and they shouldn't take more than a couple of coats (and often just one) to get a nice clean coverage with no bleed. "Layer" paints are their next ones, they have less pigment, so a bit of the colour below bleeds through - build up the layers on top of the "Base" paint, getting lighter as you go (right now just go for one or two layers till you get the hang of it). Then you have "Shades", which add definition and, well, shade as I mentioned. The other's are more specialised, but you might find a use for them - Glazes don't flow into recesses like a shade, but pool evenly. A blue glaze over a metal sword would give it a colouration without disrupting the metal underneath - like Sting glowing blue. Texture paints have grit in them and are useful for bases or terrain, mainly - but they don't do a good grass. You could use the brown instead of sand for the same effect, if it's easier. Dry paints are very dry, and are designed for drybrushing - wiping most of the paint off your brush and quickly flicking it across the model to cover only the raised areas. It's a good technique for cloth, or for dirt and the like. Very easy and quite fun to do, but you don't really need the special paint - any paint will do, really. Last are the effect paints - blood, slime, rust, corrosion. All that fun stuff. I've recently been repainting all my orcs armour with the corrosion, then a rust drybrush. Nicely effective.

Don't be afraid of just painting a mini to test new techniques - do an arm one way, a leg another. You'll soon get to grips.

+1 What creaky said...

1. I use brown dettol, UK people use fairy power spray as the alternative generally. Simple green for the US. Works on plastic and metals.

2. I wouldn't recommend GW for paints, I'd suggest Vallejo model colour. Doesn't dry up as much and is cheaper but better quality. GW has done better with its paint range though, so the washes are probably the things to get from them.

Undercoat with a spray. The GW one is quite good so go with that in either black or white, more people use black because the armour is easier to do but white is probably better for good models, apart from Minas Tirith.

As for technique, again what Creaky said, water/thin them down. Youtube will get you there in the end. The GBHL channel has a few vids, especially one about wet palette which is a good start. There's not all that much too it really, just don't put heaps of paint on your brush and keep going back for more and washing frequently.
Too much to say here really.

3. I use sand and static grass, that will last you a long while. Just try to make sure any rocks are not bigger than a models foot and the majority of it is fine stuff. A trip to the beach is suggested.

You will find that most games are on grass type boards, so green grass and a bit of dry grass patches along with some generic brown dirt goes quite well. Black rims on the bases.

And lastly, welcome

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My trade thread
http://www.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=25957&p=325932#p325932

Thanks!!

I've started with painting two Moria goblins today to give me a rough idea of just how the different stages of painting work. At the time of writing I've used the 'base' paints and then used a wash. Haven't added any 'layer' paints yet, but I'm already having some questions.

A question about the base painting, should I cover the whole area up completely or just mostly? For example their face, should I deliberately use very light strokes so the mouth, eyes, ear holes, etc. retain their black undercoat or should I just fine detail those parts later?

I also noticed when I give only a single base layer a lot of the black undercoat still shines through. Is this okay or does that mean I should apply another base layer?

And perhaps the most important question I have right now, what about brushes? I've used a standard Citadel paint brush for the base painting but I didn't find it to be suitable. This is likely due to the rather poor state my brush is in, as I've used it some times in the past (though not that often). I'm going to have to find a replacement either way, but before doing so I'd like to make sure I know how to properly maintain it so it doesn't get worn out immediately after use.

My biggest issue is that the hairs of the brush are no longer all concentrated in a straight line, there are some hairs sticking out which is a pain because it means it constantly spills over to parts where the paint doesn't belong.

What I've done in the past after switching paints or finishing painting completely is dipping the hairs of the brush in a jar with water and then strike on a piece of paper until it's approximately dry. Is there a better way of doing this or any details I should pay attention to? I also keep the head of the brush in the plastic protection you get with these Citadel brushes, is that a good idea or should I stop doing so?

And finally what size of brush should I get for the base painting, the layer painting and the fine details? I've read good things about the Winsor & Newton Series 7, if choosing that brand should I get the regular line or the special miniatures lines? Will these more expensive brushes last for some time if I maintain it well?

Thanks for the tip about the wet palette, that sounds really useful when painting larger models or multiple at once.

_________________
For scenario and campaign playthroughs, visit https://aiwendil.net/

Completely. With a basecoat, you want it to be as consistent as possible - the shades and layers will do the hard work of detailing for you.



Yeah, give it another layer. And remember that if your paint is running too much off the raised bits, you may be watering down the paint too much. You'll find the right consistency after a while, though.

In general you want multiple thin layers - but the Base paints should really only need one or two unless it's yellow or white or something bright over the black undercoat (they may need more, but not much more).



A couple of things - try not to let the paint reach the top of the bristles, where the metal bit is. It tends to collect there and dry, forcing the brush out of it's point. Also, whenever you dry or clean your brush, twist the bristles slightly to restore a point. It'll make things last much longer. You can do this by wiping it dry on a paper towel or something, but twisting the brush in your hand. Keeping the plastic protector on is a pretty good move, as it prevents the brush getting out of shape by being knocked or pushed against something.

Brush care isn't my strong point though (my collection of dead brushes is sight to behold) - I'm confident some of the far better painters on here could give you far more comprehensive advice than me. Either way, brush care is a common enough topic that I'm sure there will be articles and blogs aplenty on the topic.



My most honest advice here is to say don't worry about getting lots of expensive brushes until you're confident with using and maintaining a brush. As a beginner just learning techniques art and craft shops sell packs of brushes of the right sizes. They aren't great quality, but are cheap - and if you're anything like me then you'll go through the brushes at an alarming rate as you learn "Oh, DON'T do that! Right!".

I'm no expert on brush brands (I just tend to go between Army Painter and GW, because I can pick them up locally or with the retailer that I use online - never underestimate the appeal of laziness and convenience), so I can't help there. Personally I find the need for super fine brushes to be a touch exaggerated - I'm not nearly good enough to be painting individual highlights on a belt buckle, so I tend to make do with a thick brush (GW Basecoat brush, or similar) for washes or for when being neat isn't a concern, a 'standard' brush (easy enough to do fine details with if you just put paint on the point, honestly: a point is a point is a point is a point - if you get my point) and a really thick messy brush with bristles everywhere, varying degrees of stiffness and floppyness in the 'tip' and I think I once shaved it flat with a knife. I use that for drybrushing, applying glues and all that fun stuff that I wouldn't use a nice brush for. I don't really find much use for super fine points - but that may just be because I'm a talentless hack.

Good luck with the goblins!

I swear by tiny, tiny makeup brushes generally used for nail art. Tiny tip, and last for ages with care.
The makeup and soap chain Lush stock brushes for free use. These are generally supposed to be dumped after one use, and i doubt you're meant to take more than one, but..... i take five or six whenever i'm in the area of a Lush chain. it's not TECHNICALLY stealing, as they are samples... right?

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Thanks a lot for all the responses!
That is good to know about the base painting because I've often wondered and I've never covered it up completely, often resulting in inconsistent layers of paint. I'll look into getting some new more modest price brushes and learn how to take care of them before buying more expensive ones if ever.

I've added one additional layer for each part of the Goblins and while they certainly won't be winning any 'best painted model' prizes any time soon, they sure look a lot better than the Goblins I painted way back in the day (though that's not really saying anything :p)

I kind of rushed it but I've already learned a lot from things from doing it. It gave me a good idea of how I might proceed from here. I'm going to need a new brush that isn't completely worn out, a lot of free time to give it the time it needs, and some more paints and shades. I also haven't done any basing yet but will probably start that today.

This only leaves me with approximately 1100 miniatures to strip, paint and base.
Well, in the words of the master himself, “It is the job that is never started that takes longest to finish.”

_________________
For scenario and campaign playthroughs, visit https://aiwendil.net/

Good luck with that - I'm not exactly envious of the task before you. I know it's not exactly walking into Mordor, but it's right on up there. Hell of a way to throw yourself into the hobby.

If I was doing it, I'd strip in batches of about a couple dozen a time. This will allow you to really see progress as you plow through the horde of metal and plastic. It's a reward after the hard work. (A similar thing is useful if you're painting large numbers of troops at once - save the heroes and banner bearers so that you can reward yourself with something more fun at regular intervals. Believe me, it keeps you going.) I once tried to strip 100 odd minis at once, and put off the filthy task of scrubbing and cleaning them for so long that someone thhrew the container out when house cleaning.

If using dettol, make sure to water it down about 50/50, it should turn almost milky coloured. And use rubber gloves and an expendable surface when cleaning the kodels up after an overnight soak - the paint comes off in a thick black gunk that gets everywhere and is a nightmare to remove.

Yeah stripping in batches is what I'm planning to do. I started by stripping all my plastic Moria Goblins, with mixed results. Most still have quite a bit of paint on them, and doing this already took quite a lot of (boring) work.
So I'm not sure how I'll proceed from here with the plastic ones. I've used denatured alcohol after a recommendation from a local hobby shop owner, but while it is cheap and doesn't leave a lasting bad smell, it also wasn't that effective on most of my miniatures. Maybe I should simply try out something else, I've looked for Dettol but couldn't find the brown variant in local stores.

Anyway, here are some pictures I made from when I painted the two Moria Goblins, here is one of them, the other on the photo's is one of my older Goblins (also painted by me) I don't think I need to tell which one is which.


I still need to base them and do just a little bit more work on them (you can see in the pics there is some red paint on his skin), but it's already a huge improvement over my older models, I'm looking forward to repainting some heroes in particular.

_________________
For scenario and campaign playthroughs, visit https://aiwendil.net/

It's a heck of an improvement, to be sure. The best advice I can give righht now is to keep at it. When you can achieve a smooth coverage of paint consistently and without much effort, you'll be able to move on to more satisfying stuff. Just keep an eye out for where one bit ends and another begins - the feet for instance.

I can't help with the alcohol - although stripping paint is mostly elbow grease and mess sadly. Even the mighty brown dettol leaves the paint gloopy and clinging to the model in an almighty slop that needs sorting out.

we may be able to help each other out. ive never really played, youve never really painted. so maybe we can trade advice. i just posted in the beginner forum, so check it out if you are so inclined.

regardless, here are my tips:

first, a disclaimer: i love my style of painting, its simple and leaves the models looking half decent. but im by no means good:P. go check out the post of my favourite models if you want to see them.

now!

tip 1 - stripping.
first find a sturdy pole. joking. i use nail polish remover, works wonders on metal because metal is.. well metal. on plastic it can pull off details. but if you dip and scrub they usually stay in tact. be careful with this one until you get the hang of it

tip 2 - painting.
Brushes make a huuuge difference. i only use stiff medium sized brushes for putting on the base layer, and unlike others, i dont usually spray mine, i just base them the most common colour and work from there. be mindful when working up to seperations in colour, its always easier to work up to a ledge then down off of one (if you dont know what i mean il try to draw a diagram) this helps with cleanliness. like what was said, bases are your best friend, i use layers sparingly, 'cause i hate doing three to five million coats. i basically paint with bases alone. save for...

tip 3 - washes!

shades are amazing, they are basically liquid talent. though, they take talent to use effectively. i use them on everything to take away the gloss of normal paint. use them very sparingly and the colour doesn't change much. experiment with what happens to a colour when washed with another colour. i washed my alt Dwalin in brown even though he is mostly blue. another tip for washing is do it quick, if it dries while you are putting it on you get weird splotches and unwanted shadow effects. so do washes speedy, and then wait till it dries COMPLETELY before you do more, or you risk pulling off the bottom coat of the wash and get unwanted highlights. there are other little tips for washes so if you are interested let me know, i use washes like a crazy person so i swear by them.

tip 4 - practice
practice your bottom off. i went to school for visual arts, and have been painting and augmenting things my whole life so im lucky i had the hang of this fairly quick. if you have not done the same, then you need to start somewhere, and where better then on little tokens of tolkien. (get it?)

tip 5 - have fun

have fun and change things up, this is a hobby, and you are not going to do well if you are bored or frustrated. so take breaks when needed, and change models frequently. i usually do them assembly line style. when im done all the arms of one set of models, i move on to an other model entirely (usually a hero).

so yeah. keep on it my friend. your progress is already looking amazing.