Hey Guys,

Looking to put together a Isengard list. Here's what I've come up with, keep in mind I have 0 experience so far with WotR.

CHARACTERS

Saurman the White Hand
= 240pts

Grima Wormtongue
= 75pts

COMMON

5 Uruk-Hai Phalanx
- Captain
- Banner bearer
- Shaman
= 360pts

5 Uruk-Hai Warband (shields)
- Captain
- Banner bearer
- Shaman
= 360pts

1 Uruk-Hai Warband (crossbows)
- Captain
= 85pts

1 Uruk-Hai Warband (crossbows)
= 35pts

1 Uruk-Hai Warband (crossbows)
= 35pts

RARE

Isengard Troll
= 100pts

Isengard Troll
= 100pts

1 Uruk-Hai Bersekers
= 110pts

Total points = 1500pts

Opinions?

I am really not fond of using one company strong formations of crossbows. A three company strong formation of archers at long range rolling averagely will take the whole thing out, where as if you simply add a second company it will take three times the casualties. If you don't want to add more companies you can simply merge one of those formations with the one with the captain.

I would also consider dropping a troll in exhange for upgrading the other into a chieftain. 50 points for two might, one fight, and the all the perks of being a hero. Well worth it, in my opinion. You can then use that remaining 50 points to exchange your shamans for some allied ringwraiths. Exchanging ruin for shadow and dismay, while gaining two mastery, epic strike potential, terror, higher courage, and an amazing special rule. Another well-worth-it-upgrade, in my opinion.

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hmmmm.....

I would put the three companies of crossbows together into one formation because of the rule that when the last company in a formation reaches half strength the rest flee. Which means if you only have 1 company per formation the enemy would only need 4 hits to destroy it. That and with the three together you could grab yourself a captain to do Heroic Shoots and such.
Another thing you might consider is while Shamans can be useful they are incredibly expensive for what you get, so I would either take them out completely or at the very least substitute one for Druzhag the Beastcaller in the Misty Mountains list. (He's the same price, but has access to more spells, more might, and he has the ability to summon creatures)
Honestly unless you're going for a particular theme I would switch Grima for something else as well. He has his uses, but at 75 points he's pretty pricy. If you removed one shaman and Worm, switched the other shaman with Druzhag, and put in Lurtz (he's 175 so basically the price of the Shaman and Worm together) You got yourself a pretty tidy package.
One last thing is maybe try cutting down your Uruk Bands by 1 and removing a captain (Lurtz can take his place) so you can have a few points to spend on cavalry like Warg Riders, or Sharku's Raiders.
All in all though you should end up with a nice balanced force with a good helping of magic and fight. Good Luck!

Thanks for the comments so far guys, very helpful.

I made some changes based on your suggestions.

CHARACTERS

Saurman the White Hand
= 240pts

Lurtz
= 175pts

COMMON

4 Uruk-Hai Phalanx
- Captain
- Banner bearer
= 225pts

4 Uruk-Hai Warband (shields)
- Captain
- Banner bearer
= 225pts

3 Uruk-Hai Warband (crossbows)
- Captain
= 155pts

RARE

Isengard Troll
= 100pts

Isengard Troll
= 100pts

1 Uruk-Hai Bersekers
= 110pts

LEGENDARY

3 Sharku's Hunters (shields)
= 165pts

Total points = 1495pts

As you can see I made some pretty large changes.

First off I dropped Grima for Lurtz.

I drop the 2 large infantry units down to 4 companies strong and merge the x-bows into one unit.

I added Sharku's hunters for some speed on my flanks.

Anyone like the changes?
Time of Madness

Looks great
You have good spell potential in Saruman and a good Hero/Cavalry killer in Lurtz.
The reason I suggested bringing down the size of your common formations is for one I never like putting to many eggs in one basket, and two a very large formation can have a hard time maneuvering through terrain/ jumping into a defensible terrain feature. I always think that 4 (orcs and goblins excluded) companies is a happy medium between size and ease of use.
Other thing is make sure you added up Sharkus Hunters right. I know in most of the battle reports available they add it up as: 75 points for Sharku + 25 points for each company, but in the book it says that the first company purchased is the command company and has Sharku included in the cost. This means that your formation of Sharku's Hunters would be 140 rather then 165.
Be sure to give an update on how your games turn out.

I'm just posting to say that the cost of these kinds of formations is still very much up in the air, assuming of course some word hasn't gotten out that I missed. IMO it is very clear that the cost should be 165 as the book definitely states +30 per company, not +30 per additional company. As it is, we have to wait for an FAQ to answer this question (and many others). Most important thing is to just make sure that all the people you play with are on the same page. As long as everyone does it the same it doesn't matter too much which cost gets used.

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hmmmm.....

I can see why that's how it looks, and to be honest that's how I used to add up the points, but I had to change my mind.
First which I already mentioned was that under where it says command in a Legendary Formation it says: The first company purchased is automatically the command company and has *hero's name* included in the base cost. Meaning the first number you see in the cost of the formation is the command company (which it clearly says includes the hero) , and the + x for each company is after the purchase of the command company.
The other problem I would have with having the initial cost added to the cost of one of the companies is that in cases like Rohan where you can have a Hero in a Legendary Formation or as a single Epic Hero the costs are all wrong. For Example: Theodred and Theodred's Knights. As an Epic Hero he costs 125 and has Epic Sacrifice, Defence, Intervention, and he has 3 might instead of 2. As a Legendary formation the 135 pays for him and a Banner. If we added it up that we would have to spend an additional 45 points for the first company as well that would mean the hero alone would cost 145 points. So he's 20 points more expensive then he is as an Epic Hero, and you lose all his Epic Actions, and a point of might. Seems like a pretty raw deal to me.

I'm working on my Isengard army as well, and I can see a lot of similarities with yours.

From what I can tell, it looks good.


In regards with the Legendary Companies, I can see it both ways.
Just like stated above, it seems very odd that Theodred should cost more but yet loose everything that made him cost so much.
On the other hand, Shakru becomes a steal with 1 more might point, extra special rule and upgrade to expert riders for the same points as a normal orc captain. And Vrashkû getting Take Aim and 1 might for 10 points extra.

Hey thanks for the comments gents.

So if I remove the 2 captains from the main combat blocks I'll have an extra 100pts. Any idea on what I should spend that on? I could throw in a company of 3 uruk-hai scouts with either shields or bows?

As far as the legendary companies go my friends and I just use the point costs listed on army builder. I figures as long as everyone is consistent it's not a big deal.

Thanks,
Time of Madness

I wouldn't drop the captains. The extra might is very worthwhile and can make quite a bit of difference.

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hmmmm.....