...this whole thing: the move the finecast, the drop in quality, the increase in price, the change to the pricing and quantity in the plastic model kits ---- I've had it with GW. They are so full of themselves and they don't give a sh!t about us loyal fans. They have shown no respect for the LotR cannon, neither have they shown any real dedication in putting out a superior product. They're ripping us off and laughing their @sses off about it all the way to the bank because we keep forking over the cash and saying dumb stuff like: "this stuff isn't so bad, you have have to warm it up for a bit to get it to fit together."

Get a grip people, they are ripping us off at every turn and it's only going to get worse until we do something about it. I, for one, and refusing to buy anymore of their tripe until they smarten up and quit producing a substandard product. And it pains me so much because I am such a student of the JRRT world, at one point I could've been convince that the backstory writers at LotR SBG cared as much about the minutia of Middle Earth backstory as I do.... I've come to see that all they care about is profit and I can, no longer in good conscience continue to feed their greed.

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Woodland Realms: 2382 pts: 18/08/2010

Kk. I'm sure GW won't mind. They already got their money.

very much agreed, maybe we could send them a letter with all our signatures?

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"make me lunch... worthy of Mordor"

Feel better now? I understand how you feel, but they ARE a for-profit corporation.

On a side note, I cringe to see the word "rape" thrown around in this kind of context. Rape is a terrible, violent, dehumanizing act, and we should not blithely use it to describe our disdain for what is, in essence, a voluntary business transaction.

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Respectfully,
Jonathan

Do what is right, love mercy, and walk humbly

Battle Companies

That implies that GW some how owes it to you to produce what you want. That is simply untrue. Until GW stops selling well enough to support a business, you're not going to get any change.

I've seen TONNES of threads on warseer of people putting up positions. And I laugh. They're a company out to make profit, and they're doing that just fine (better than fine...) so why would they listen to a group of snotty nerds on a forum that aren't 100% happy?

They're not forcing you to buy their product, it's not a necessity, it's a luxury. If you're not happy, don't buy it. But really I think we've seen enough people complaining at what they don't like without another thread opening up.
I don't like the prices, but I don't complain about them, I just don't spend as much...

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++ THE VANUS TEMPLE ++
Contact for commissions!

Ha ha a little harsh Dezartfox but you make a valid point - Finecast is a new venture and with anything new there will be hiccups to begin with - we just have to trust that these teething problems will be ironed out. Theres no way I'm giving up on my collection because of a change of material even if I do have to give my models a warm bath to make them fit together

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Commission Availability : BOOKED SOLID (again lol)

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Very well said, on both points.

I mainly said that because right now, I am snotty

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Their profits over the years have remained stable. Meanwhile, they've been increasing prices year on year. So they've either lost customers, or people are buying less. Not exactly ideal in the long term, considering that GW's strategy is to sell as many miniatures as possible.

Now, I'm not going to say too much here on this, as enough has been said on these forums already (including by myself). But everyone has to decide where they will draw the line. How much are you willing to pay for plastic and metal (now resin) models? Plastics are now over £1 per model, and some Finecast heroes are pushing £10 a piece. http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1500325a How many times are you willing to be screwed around?

I drew that line and its been crossed already, so I've stopped buying for 40K and LOTR, simple as that. The last time I purchased LOTR was two years ago, 40K one year ago (and that was only thing all year). I'm fortunate in that I have large backlogs for both games, but there are still plenty of miniatures that I'd like, even a few of the Finecast ones (of which I have not bought any). But I'm not willing to pay the prices. I'm now looking at using my new Historical miniatures (Gripping Beast Saxons) to proxy as Rohan or Rhovanion, and will look at ebay.

Bottom line is, prices have been going up fast for years and show no sign whatsoever of stopping or even slowing down. So decide for yourself how much you will tolerate.

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My (more regularly updated) painting blog:
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The profits aren't stable, they've risen, GW have one of the highest pay-outs per share. Which is the issue really... they want profits.

GW's problem is they are creating short term solutions to problems, such as price rises. Profits are up, but customer count and sales are down, they also think they're untouchable by the recession (which they're doing a damn good job at being actually).

They've already done their research into what makes money, and the research shows that it is little Jimmy going to the store, buying the intro stuff and a few boxes of models, maybe spending £200 at most, and then losing interest. That is where the money is at. If he stays than even better! They make more money that way then trying to keep us grumpy lot happy all the time. We get appeased by the new releases and having no self control and buying them

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++ THE VANUS TEMPLE ++
Contact for commissions!

Well, of course, we don't have to buy the stuff and I have registered the fact that I won't. Does this mean that we shouldn't feel a bit peeved and to say so?

No, for 3 reasons:

(1) There is a value for money issue here. The products don't have to cost so much. I appreciate that there must be hefty licence fees and the cost of the material has increased, yet other manufacturers produce equivalent products for noticeably less. Indeed, other manufacturers can out-perform GW in terms of quality for the same price or less. I recently painted up some multi-part hard plastic 28mm Romans from Warlord Games. These were very competatively priced, but most significantly, were a significant stride ahead of GW plastics;

(2) There is an access to Tolkien issue. It is possible to find "proxies" from other manufacturer's ranges, historical or generic fantasy, for most things from the Fellowship to the Rohirrim. In fact, there is a current thread showing some excellent figures for Gandalf and the rest of the White Council. I don't play tornaments (I don't play, in fact) so the need to use GW figures is not a great concern for me. For others it is a problem. To an extent, silly rules and characters can be ignored, but sub-standard and over-priced models are a concern.

So, while I recognise that GW must make a profit from LOTR to support Exec salaries, share dividends and a multitude of Warhammer Gaming venues staffed by odd people with limited social skills and a poor sense of other's personal space, I, nevertheless, come away feeling that GW is increasingly content to milk what it sees as a captive audience rather than give fans value for money.

I am captive no longer. This leads merely to my ultimate concern; GW has given us 2 great games and some really good figures. What if GW's current excessively exploitative approach back fires and, instead of sustaining the range, leads to the withdrawal of certain products, reliance on more populist products, further price hikes and ulimately and decline or even cessessation of the LOTR range and its support?

The irony is, I get so cross with GW because I want the LOTR range to survive. Please, GW, just stop f' ng things up.

GW are a buissness that make a game that i love, with the miniatures that i love with the fantasy realm that i love. How could I ever hate them? Yes they have high prices, which is why I have ebay. yes they have a few models I dont like but i just won't buy them. I don't really understand how you could feel so angry about this...

er, because we're getting shafted. Thats why.

So tell me, if they raised the prices for the 12 model boxes to £15 would you still be happy? £18? £20? 'cos it'll happen sooner or later, once the current prices are normalised GW will feel confident enough to raise the prices yet again. And again. As others have said, this hobby and its miniatures are a LUXURY. Well, for many, including myself its fast becoming an unaffordable Luxury. We don't want to quit - on the contrary I certainly want to get a lot more from the LOTR and 40K ranges. But at these prices, its just not worth it. Ebay is all well and good but at the end of the day, theres not enough stuff around on ebay for everyone.



This. ^ GW does absolutely NOTHING to encourage customer loyalty. They couldn't care less if people get fed up and quit, because they know they can make profit off new gullible players who spend a few hundred quid, only play for a short while then lose interest and quit. LOTR has no long term future if they don't try to retain players for longer as opposed to treating people like cash cows on a conveyor belt.

I expect SBG will have a lifespan of 5-10 years at most, after the last Hobbit film. If there are no new LOTR films on the horizon at that time, then there'll be nothing to sustain interest in it. Sure, theres always us die hards but GW doesn't make its vast profits from us and may well decide that its no longer profitable and pull the plug.

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My (more regularly updated) painting blog:
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Venting on the forum is ok so-
It wont do much good
Declaring your undying love or hate won't help
Attacking capitalism and profit or evil corporations We are going to get no where there
So what can we do?
Write a NICE letter to the GW CEO expressing your concern about quality control or what ever. If it does not work. Write the license holders or Peter Jackson.
What burns beside witches? MORE WITCHES!
Don't go carrying pictures of Chairman Mao.

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"the same as a duck you must be made of wood"

Agreed. They belong on the wall,

edit:

Just saw this, thank you for posting this.

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Talaan-u rûk-ir tor Urûk
Nauru-ir agh kragoru nûrsu grishûrz
Nork-ulu furtun agh goð
Mordor-ob bot-tuk

How is it GW's fault that we keep buying from them? It's not like they're actually stealing from us.

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"Leave Sauron to me."
If you're in the Raleigh, NC area, let me know.

Vote with your wallets guys, but know that it won't do you much good. GW isn't even close to pricing themselves out of the market, and people are just eating these models up. The fact is that GW is making money, and they are making money pretty well. Until there is a mass migration away from their brand, nothing will happen.

NP

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Respectfully,
Jonathan

Do what is right, love mercy, and walk humbly

Battle Companies

They will continue to get money, they will increase the prices until no one would buy anymore... Not even the most loyal...
Then they will regret...
It may happen in a long time, but it will happen if they don't change minds